Preserving some unique items, and should I

[Seijun]

I bought a set of three hand-sculpted and painted clay miller "copies" back in January. I only know that they were "originally in the collection of R. Smith, and were sold after his death". If anyone knows who R. Smith is, please let me know. Anyway, I don't know who made the three sculptures, when they were made, why, or if they were important to whoever made or owned them. For some reason, the sculptor made them out of a soft, non-hardening clay. Its a lot like plastiline if anyone has ever worked with that. It is not meant to last, and it gets especially soft when the temp is warm.

The sculptures themselves are in poor condition. They have a lot of bumps and bruises, and several limbs are falling off (they did not fare too well when they were shipped to me). I have been keeping them in my freezer to preserve them as much as possible. I have been mulling over the idea of having a hard plaster copy made of each, which would be permanent and preserve the likeness each sculpture, but the process would destroy the originals. I can't decide if this is the best thing to do, or the worst. Destroy the originals to make permanent copies? Or keep the originals and risk having them completely fall apart eventually? (I can keep them in my freezer until I die, but I don't really see them surviving long beyond that). What are your thoughts?

Here is a pic, sorry it is horrible, will get a better one this weekend. They are larger than the original millers and they cost me about $100 for the set. They are terribly ugly, but charmingly so.

[SBell]

Riff Smith was one of the premier collectors and a major contributor to PT Magazine until his untimely death about 5 years ago.  Much of his collection was sold off (by Joe Demarco, I think) to support his family.

His articles were the ones that were important fro discussing groups and species, and mentioning the figures that had been made (complete with a signature ending about how more figures of that species/group would be good). Phil Hore fills that role now, but not nearly as well.

Riff's collection was huge, featuring figures that spanned time and the world (I have some, like many of his Starlux figures).

Those Millers feel soft because they are soft--they are made of wax, as Miller is/was a candle company. Many of the dinos were made in large and small sizes, so you might have some large ones.  They generally haven't survived well overall, and even in modest condition can be worth a lot.

[Seijun]

Thank you for the info on Smith.
These millers are not the original large wax millers. I have the original large millers, and they are indeed made from a wax or wax-based plastic. The three in the picture are made from solid, non-hardening, wax-based modeling clay. I can literally bend and unbend the tails, squish the clay into different shapes. or stick my finger right into the clay if I so choose (it's that soft). Having sculpted with plasteline before, I am 100% sure that they are plasteline or a very similar type of modeling clay. They even smell like plasteline.

[SBell]

Thank you for the info on Smith.
These millers are not the original large wax millers. I have the original large millers, and they are indeed made from a wax or wax-based plastic. The three in the picture are made from solid, non-hardening, wax-based modeling clay. I can literally bend and unbend the tails, squish the clay into different shapes. or stick my finger right into the clay if I so choose (it's that soft). Having sculpted with plasteline before, I am 100% sure that they are plasteline or a very similar type of modeling clay. They even smell like plasteline.

Maybe they are some sort of master, or concept sculpt? Riff had an amazingly diverse collection, and if anyone would have had something like that, it would have been him.

[Seijun]

They are not masters for the original Millers. They look different (larger, uglier), so they could be concept designs, but I was under the impression that they were made after the original millers, not before. Who do you think would know? (Smith's family? The miller company if they still exist?) I will get back in touch with the person I bought them from, see if they have any more info that could help me.
The person I bought them from just said they were "copies". They are not signed or marked. If they are concept designs for the original Millers I dont think I would want to do anything to them (at least not at present).

[amargasaurus cazaui]

if they were mine, I would figure out if I could coat them in simple wax, to protect them, either by poring it over them or dipping, and then wrap the wax castings in tinfoil. This would hold their shape, integrity and design, and prevent them from slipping flat or being damaged further. Just an suggestion......

[SBell]

They are not masters for the original Millers. They look different (larger, uglier), so they could be concept designs, but I was under the impression that they were made after the original millers, not before. Who do you think would know? (Smith's family? The miller company if they still exist?) I will get back in touch with the person I bought them from, see if they have any more info that could help me.
The person I bought them from just said they were "copies". They are not signed or marked. If they are concept designs for the original Millers I dont think I would want to do anything to them (at least not at present).

Mike Fredericks at PT Magazine might. Randy Knol is another person that might. Don Glut is another collector of older and odd dinos. And of course Joe Demarco.  I don't have contact for any of these people, but they can be found online or through PT.

[Seijun]

Thanks!

[Invicta Hunter]

If you wanted to make a copy in plastic to display you could try using a 3D printing company. They aren't that common at the moment but there is some around and in a couple of years it's going to really take off. So this might just be the best way of preserving the likeness of delicate figures in the near future. Here's a video on the subject   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQHnMj6dxj4

[Seijun]

Ugh, the video says it is blocked in my country for copyright reasons.

Are you meaning the type of #D printing where they scan the object to create a 3D model on the computer?

[Invicta Hunter]

Strange the video doesn't work, you could just go on youtube and type in 3D printer and it should come up with the same video. Anyway yeah you can scan it and then the 3D printer prints it out in plastic form. 

[Seijun]

Something like that would probably be way out of my price range :/ (and would probably require me to ship the originals).

[Invicta Hunter]

You can buy these machines for your home but give it a couple of years and the price will come down. It's perfect for anyone who likes sculpting, you can make your own dinosaur and then print a hard copy for display.

[stoneage]

My Marx "One Million BC" playset belonged to Riff Smith and I obtained it through Joe Demarco.  I don't know anything about these figures, but I'm curious where you obtained them and how do you know they are authentic?  If it were me I'd check to see what the individuals Bell mentioned might know.  Also I'd probably keep these figures on ice until I could find a sufficent way to preserve them.  They could be something really special.

[stoneage]

Do you have a Miller collection?

[Seijun]

I got my set from a collector who got them through Joe. I just spoke with Joe about them, and this is the info he gave me:

"The clay Millers belonged to a friend of Riff's that died a couple years before him. I never got a name from Riff.  Only knew the guy wasn't really a dinosaur collector so to speak.  He had broken Millers from his childhood and filled in missing pieces with modeling clay.  I  think the Megatherium sloth may have been made entirely of clay while the others are a mixture of original Millers dinosaurs and clay overlay and fill.  A mutual friend of mine and Riff's has the T- Rex but I do not know of any others although I cannot say there were not others.  They are larger than original Millers because the clay is overlaid the actual Miller wax making them bulkier and larger at least that is what Riff told me back in the day."

stoneage: I have all of the large wax millers minus the mammoth, but most of them are broken pretty badly. I was going to repair them all but the price of millers has come way down so I might just buy unbroken ones to replace them.

[stoneage]

I got my set from a collector who got them through Joe. I just spoke with Joe about them, and this is the info he gave me:

"The clay Millers belonged to a friend of Riff's that died a couple years before him. I never got a name from Riff.  Only knew the guy wasn't really a dinosaur collector so to speak.  He had broken Millers from his childhood and filled in missing pieces with modeling clay.  I  think the Megatherium sloth may have been made entirely of clay while the others are a mixture of original Millers dinosaurs and clay overlay and fill.  A mutual friend of mine and Riff's has the T- Rex but I do not know of any others although I cannot say there were not others.  They are larger than original Millers because the clay is overlaid the actual Miller wax making them bulkier and larger at least that is what Riff told me back in the day."

stoneage: I have all of the large wax millers minus the mammoth, but most of them are broken pretty badly. I was going to repair them all but the price of millers has come way down so I might just buy unbroken ones to replace them.

I'd like to see some Millers in the Dinosaur Toy Line thread.  I really like them but I don't have any.  They are quite expensive and it is hard to find them in totally unbroken condition.

[Seijun]

Mine are broken pretty good. Its not too expensive for ones that only have a small amount of damage.