Knock-off figures - general discussion

[Neosodon]

If you take an overpriced piece of crap and make it better and sell it cheaper you can hardly call that boot legging. I think shleich actually kind of deserves it. Well it's not anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling a inferior version of it.

[Rain]

If you take an overpriced piece of crap and make it better and sell it cheaper you can hardly call that boot legging. I think shleich actually kind of deserves it. Well it's not anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling a inferior version of it.

Uhhh... what? That's still boot legging. As for making it better, all they did was repaint it. I also doubt the finished product looks anything like the promo pic.

[Neosodon]

If you take an overpriced piece of crap and make it better and sell it cheaper you can hardly call that boot legging. I think shleich actually kind of deserves it. Well it's not anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling a inferior version of it.

Uhhh... what? That's still boot legging.

Never said it wasn't, just that you can hardly call it that.

[Rain]

If you take an overpriced piece of crap and make it better and sell it cheaper you can hardly call that boot legging. I think shleich actually kind of deserves it. Well it's not anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling a inferior version of it.

Uhhh... what? That's still boot legging.

Never said it wasn't, just that you can hardly call it that.

And why can you hardly call re-casting a figure, repainting it and selling it as your own, bootlegging? Because the promo pic has a more appealing paintjob? Lol...

[stargatedalek]

If you take an overpriced piece of crap and make it better and sell it cheaper you can hardly call that boot legging. I think shleich actually kind of deserves it. Well it's not anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling a inferior version of it.

Uhhh... what? That's still boot legging. As for making it better, all they did was repaint it. I also doubt the finished product looks anything like the promo pic.

They also filled some of the seams, and managed to produce a product of near identical quality for much less cost.

That promotional image depicts a poor enough paint application that it's definitely a real sample.

[Neosodon]

If you take an overpriced piece of crap and make it better and sell it cheaper you can hardly call that boot legging. I think shleich actually kind of deserves it. Well it's not anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling a inferior version of it.

Uhhh... what? That's still boot legging.

Never said it wasn't, just that you can hardly call it that.

And why can you hardly call re-casting a figure, repainting it and selling it as your own, bootlegging? Because the promo pic has a more appealing paintjob? Lol...

Ok, looks like I'll have to explain it in detail. The problem with bootlegs is they can be mistaken for the original piece but are almost always worse. So you buy a model thinking it's the real thing and end up getting a major disappointment which has happened to me before. With this shleich raptor that is not the case since the bootleg may be better or at least as good as the original. Also if a massive filthy rich company like shleich that has the capability to produce their figures decently and inexpensively is getting shown up on both price and quality by a band of bootleggers I think they deserve it in a way even though that doesn't necessarily excuse the actions of the bootleggers. Shleich isn't a small sincere company of skilled artists struggling to make a living off their work - it's quite the opposite. Their not going out of buisness because some bootlegger tried to improve on one of their lazy rip off figures. Yeah it's still bootlegging but just not "anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling an inferior version of it."

[tyrantqueen]

Ok, looks like I'll have to explain it in detail. The problem with bootlegs is they can be mistaken for the original piece but are almost always worse. So you buy a model thinking it's the real thing and end up getting a major disappointment which has happened to me before. With this shleich raptor that is not the case since the bootleg may be better or at least as good as the original. Also if a massive filthy rich company like shleich that has the capability to produce their figures decently and inexpensively is getting shown up on both price and quality by a band of bootleggers I think they deserve it in a way even though that doesn't necessarily excuse the actions of the bootleggers. Shleich isn't a small sincere company of skilled artists struggling to make a living off their work - it's quite the opposite. Their not going out of buisness because some bootlegger tried to improve on one of their lazy rip off figures. Yeah it's still bootlegging but just not "anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling an inferior version of it."

NO one "deserves" to have their artwork bootlegged. I don't even like most of Doug Watson's pieces but I hate the idea of his art being stolen. It's obvious he puts a lot of love and passion into his work.

We don't know who sculpts the Schleich dinosaurs but how do we know how they feel about their work being sold without their consent? What's wrong is still wrong, even if you show partiality to one artist because you happen to like what they produce.

For me, it's a matter of personal ethics. I care about the artist's rights first and foremost. Which I which I refuse to buy any bootleg now. I will admit I've bought bootlegs in the past, out of curiosity, but they sucked and weren't worth the money.

[stargatedalek]

Most artists don't get paid on percentage and are contractually obligated not to sell their sculpts to multiple companies, so it shouldn't actually hurt them at all personally. May it hurt their feelings? Sure, maybe, who knows, but it doesn't hurt their rights when someone bootlegs a sculpt that they already sold.

The only ones being hurt here are Schleich corporate, not whomever Schleich hired to sculpt the raptor, that person was already paid and would not have been able to make money off of that sculpt ever again regardless. And Schleich corporate has been overcharging for inferior products for years, if someone else has really proven they can produce something of near identical quality for significantly less cost the point could definitely be made that they are doing a better job.

[Simon]

Most artists don't get paid on percentage and are contractually obligated not to sell their sculpts to multiple companies, so it shouldn't actually hurt them at all personally. May it hurt their feelings? Sure, maybe, who knows, but it doesn't hurt their rights when someone bootlegs a sculpt that they already sold.

The only ones being hurt here are Schleich corporate, not whomever Schleich hired to sculpt the raptor, that person was already paid and would not have been able to make money off of that sculpt ever again regardless. And Schleich corporate has been overcharging for inferior products for years, if someone else has really proven they can produce something of near identical quality for significantly less cost the point could definitely be made that they are doing a better job.

Bootlegging a big toy company's figures most definitely DOES hurt the artists who make the sculpts, because if a company cannot make a profit from its prehistoric figures due to competition from bootlegs, they may not do as many figures, which means that the artists will get fewer commissions from them in the future.

[Rain]

If you take an overpriced piece of crap and make it better and sell it cheaper you can hardly call that boot legging. I think shleich actually kind of deserves it. Well it's not anywhere near as bad as it would be if someone took Doug's wonderful Triceratops and started selling a inferior version of it.

Uhhh... what? That's still boot legging. As for making it better, all they did was repaint it. I also doubt the finished product looks anything like the promo pic.

They also filled some of the seams, and managed to produce a product of near identical quality for much less cost.

That promotional image depicts a poor enough paint application that it's definitely a real sample.

Again, I don't see how that makes it "hardly" a boot leg. They filled in a few seams so what? They still STOLE the entire sculpt...

And you can't say that without having the figure in hand.
Here's a promo pic for a bootleg Rebor



Here's the actual product



The actual product is far skinnier.

[Neosodon]

To make an analogy, if a thief robbed a con artist or scammer I would just think karma even though I don't agree with the actions of the thief. I wouldn't feel anywhere near as upset as I would have if the thief had stolen from an honest hard working man instead. The fact that so many stores here in the U.S choose shleich over the far superior in every aspect and local company safari ltd makes me rather suspicious. Maybe the reason they sell so many cheap but overpriced figures is because they need that money to bribe the store owners just to keep their products on the shelves. Bootlegging is still bootlegging regardless who the victim is but that doesn't mean have have to be all sympathetic toward shleich when I think they deserve it.

[yankeetrex]

Found a few doozies this morning on Taobao, and one that I think Im going to buy to customize......









And the Star of the bunch.....

[Rain]

Wow, that Spinosaurus is a Papo chimera. It has the head of their Baryonyx, the limbs of their Spinosaurus and the tail belongs to their Allosaurus. I wonder how the bootleggers made it.

EDIT: On second thought, it could just be the Spinosaurus tail, they're both very similar.

[Nanuqsaurus]

Wow, that Spinosaurus is a Papo chimera. It has the head of their Baryonyx, the limbs of their Spinosaurus and the tail  belongs to their Allosaurus. I wonder how the bootleggers made it.

Yeah, it sure is an interesting figure! It's actually kinda cool how they combined different parts. Of course it's very awesomebro, but still interesting.

[Lanthanotus]

Haven't read through all 32 pages of this thread before, so I am not totally surre this point has been brought up before....

... sure there are bootleggers out there, no question,.... but we as customers, can we be certain some of those "bootlegs" aren't really legal, but secenod quality sort outs from the original producer, selling those cheaper and under another brand? I worked for a paper producing company once and the exact same product was packed, labeled and sold for several prices of like +- 20 to 30 % and that's not including any second quality of the same product. As in all industrial production processes there must be products that do not meet the highest quality standards but are not scrap material to be discarded....

?

[stargatedalek]

Haven't read through all 32 pages of this thread before, so I am not totally surre this point has been brought up before....

... sure there are bootleggers out there, no question,.... but we as customers, can we be certain some of those "bootlegs" aren't really legal, but secenod quality sort outs from the original producer, selling those cheaper and under another brand? I worked for a paper producing company once and the exact same product was packed, labeled and sold for several prices of like +- 20 to 30 % and that's not including any second quality of the same product. As in all industrial production processes there must be products that do not meet the highest quality standards but are not scrap material to be discarded....

?

That definitely does happen too, although I can't think of any specific examples.

There are also a few cases of companies buying each others old molds, one notable example is Safari and Schleich both have a tortoise (Safari labels it an Aldabra tortoise) using the same mold.

[Megalosaurus]

That papo monster is AMAZING! As a toy of course.

[IrritatorRaji]

And the Star of the bunch.....

I need that, omg.

[IrritatorRaji]

Found a few doozies this morning on Taobao, and one that I think Im going to buy to customize......

Ah yes, Torosaurus

[ZoPteryx]

Whoa!  That Spinosaurus is one bootleg I certainly wouldn't mind owning!