Anything Psittacosaurus

[stargatedalek]

I found it alright, omnivorous psittacosaurus is hardly improbable

[Ultimatedinoking]

I found it alright, omnivorous psittacosaurus is hardly improbable

I think all ceratopsians were omnivorous.

[amargasaurus cazaui]

I think any herbivore is likely to take in bugs, and what not while eating plants in larger quantities and just about any animal will generally steal an egg to eat if chance presents and it is hungry, however I question psittacosaurus being an active fishing dinosaur. Several things make it unlikely...starting with his manus and ability to move his arms to any great degree in front of himself. For instance it is likely the arms could not be used to move anything close to its chest or face. Remember psittacosaurus had only three large fingers and a vestigal digit . If they were fishing it would seem likely they would not have been evolving away from the five digit configuration known to be present for more derived ceratopsians.Aside from that issue the dinosaur also has a sharp large beak to the front of its face, and within its cheeks are teeth that are bulbous somewhat flat and rounded teeth that would be useless for holding or tearing up fish.They are more suited to grinding plant matter. I also seldom see gastroliths found in association with animals that eat meats or fish, however I can show you dozens of specimens of psittacosaur that have been found with gastroliths within the body cavity.
  Aside from that issue, I kept wondering why psittacosaurus is being portrayed with a Spinosaurid, and a Brachiosaurus in the same place and at the extinction event, when psittacosaurs were all gone roughly 90 million years ago. So I wouldnt say it was very accurate or even likely in any context .

    @ Cammy...yes that piece has always amazed me. I believe the specimen actually has 34 young in it. I hope to find the actual paper for that specimen as well. It highly suggests paternal or rearing behavior in a dinosaur far less evolved than those known from Horner's reasearch and far more primitive.

[Ultimatedinoking]

I think any herbivore is likely to take in bugs, and what not while eating plants in larger quantities and just about any animal will generally steal an egg to eat if chance presents and it is hungry, however I question psittacosaurus being an active fishing dinosaur. Several things make it unlikely...starting with his manus and ability to move his arms to any great degree in front of himself. For instance it is likely the arms could not be used to move anything close to its chest or face. Remember psittacosaurus had only three large fingers and a vestigal digit . If they were fishing it would seem likely they would not have been evolving away from the five digit configuration known to be present for more derived ceratopsians.Aside from that issue the dinosaur also has a sharp large beak to the front of its face, and within its cheeks are teeth that are bulbous somewhat flat and rounded teeth that would be useless for holding or tearing up fish.They are more suited to grinding plant matter. I also seldom see gastroliths found in association with animals that eat meats or fish, however I can show you dozens of specimens of psittacosaur that have been found with gastroliths within the body cavity.
  Aside from that issue, I kept wondering why psittacosaurus is being portrayed with a Spinosaurid, and a Brachiosaurus in the same place and at the extinction event, when psittacosaurs were all gone roughly 90 million years ago. So I wouldnt say it was very accurate or even likely in any context .

    @ Cammy...yes that piece has always amazed me. I believe the specimen actually has 34 young in it. I hope to find the actual paper for that specimen as well. It highly suggests paternal or rearing behavior in a dinosaur far less evolved than those known from Horner's reasearch and far more primitive.

Probably not fish, but it's not unreasonable to think of triceratops living like a boar or entelodont, still chewin plants, but eating corpses it finds, after all, meats good for animals.

As for living with a brachiosaurus, transformers isn't known for its scientific accuracy.

[amargasaurus cazaui]

I just came across this:
http://phys.org/news/2014-08-paleontologists-dinosaur-young-babysitter.html

Blah...hate...just hate when this happens. The specimen with the young and the older "babysitter" has been ruled to be a clever fake, with the skull of the more mature specimen just glued onto the existing fossil. More details here......this happens so often with Chinese fossils especially.
http://www.ivpp.cas.cn/.../201403/P020140314396046816292.pdf

[amargasaurus cazaui]

I was able to get the entire paper on psittacosaurus integument through Facebook finally. I know Aaron said he would like to have it, if anyone else was wanting to read the full version rather than the abstract please let me know by PM with your email and I will forward a link where you can get it as well

[amargasaurus cazaui]

Having read the entire formal paper, regarding the integument of Psittacosaurus I was quite impressed. The specimen that they found actual scales preserved with, is none other than SMF R 4970, the quilled specimen that has already raised such a flap. The authors describe three types of scales present and compare the scale patterns to Chasmosaurus for instance. They interpret the coloration of the dinosaur as browns, tans and patterned with darker scales surrounded by rings of lighter color, like amber and tan. With a darker pattern dorsally and lightening ventrally......this little fossil has really done a job for science . The authors went on to speculate cause of death was predation, caused by bites, attributed in the paper, if I understood correctly as being from Tianyulong. I kept re-reading this part because for instance wiki lists Tianyulong at 158 MYA, and Psittacosaurus was generally thought to be roughly 130-9o MYA. Still that appears to be what the paper is stating, perhaps A few who got it might have some thoughts.

[Balaur]

I am currently working on a Psittacosaurus picture fr my art class. I'm wondering, do we know exactly what Psittacosaurus ate?

[amargasaurus cazaui]

I am currently working on a Psittacosaurus picture fr my art class. I'm wondering, do we know exactly what Psittacosaurus ate?

I can show you picture after picture of psittacosaurus fossil with gastroliths in the chest cavity. I have never seen a carnivore that used gastroliths .......It is most likely that psittacosaurus used its beak to snip and nip off leaves and grasses, and then used its grinding teeth to process it before swallowing. I am sure it might have taken an egg now and then or perhaps bugs.....I even asked Aaron to pose one of his models as if it were digging for roots. Still plants is the best answer......

[Megalosaurus]

Having read the entire formal paper.

Immpresive. I have to read it this weekend.
Regarding colors in fossils, I'll often agree with the pattern, and with the lighter and darker statements, but not with the colors itselves. May be browns have a red or orange tint to it, may be tans have a subtle green or so.
Amazing findings anyway. I'll post again when I finish to read the paper.

[amargasaurus cazaui]

Here you go Balaur...this is my own dinosaur's skull. Notice the small beak and mouth, as well as shape of the teeth...rather obvious this fellow was a plant eater .





as an aside it always strikes me how the fossilization in this particular dinosaur is almost purple, or a light shade of it. The coloration is very striking and makes the teeth look like they are made of amethyst.

[Balaur]

Nice fossil. What I meant when I said what did it eat is what plants did it eat. I already know it's a herbivore.

[Megalosaurus]

Thank you Amargasaurus, I've already read the paper.

I'm so amazed by the conservation degree of that specimen. Also I love how the autors compared their findings with modern species.
Its fantastic to see the actual scales (not just impressions), to know their size, form and distribution. The pattern also is quite interesting. But...
Black, browns, ambers? I'm still not 100% convinced, perhaps 75% given the detailed explanations of the autors.
I'm waiting for the first paleoarts based in this descriptions. 

[amargasaurus cazaui]

I have made the psittacosaurus paper availible by request, free to anyone who wants it. The reason I did not just post a link is I am unsure how the rules in Paywalled papers work. I asked someone on facebook to get the paper for me and they did. I am unsure wether they paid or used a college access or what and I would prefer not to get that person into a problem. Bottom line is the paper was given to me and I will give anyone who asks for it the link, but I felt nervous posting it in yet another forum. Perhaps the experts can clarify this mess for me.

     Meantime I wished to ask those who are able to read through it and have, did you also feel the authors were stating this dinosaur died from an injury caused by Tianyulong? I had always understood that Tianyulong would have been an herbivore, and yet they seem to be suggest it predatorized this particular animal. I also understood Tianyulong to have lived late Jurassic and most conventional thinking places Psittacosaurus in the early Cretaceous. Thoughts? Was everyone as sold as I am that they determined the correct coloration and that they made a solid case for the colors and shades they stated? This fossil just keeps giving us gold...first quills, then preserved actual scales, not impressions.....evidence of predation...just a really stunning find.

[Balaur]

Well, the paper was published in 2010, and when Tianyulong was found in 2010, it was thought to be from the early Cretaceous, before further research showed it was middle Jurassic. Also, I think heterodontosaurs are omnivorous, and wouldn't be surprised if it ate other dinosaurs. I think the colour study is pretty accurate. It sounds like the types of colours a herbivorous forest animal would need to stay camouflaged. I'm trying to think what else could have made those bite marks. I'm thinking if it is a bite mark, it probably was Sinocalliopteryx, which is known to have fed on ornithischians. However, it is possible that it may be from some intraspecific conflict, possibly over mates or territory? I agree, this is a fascinating find.

[amargasaurus cazaui]

Well, the paper was published in 2010, and when Tianyulong was found in 2010, it was thought to be from the early Cretaceous, before further research showed it was middle Jurassic. Also, I think heterodontosaurs are omnivorous, and wouldn't be surprised if it ate other dinosaurs. I think the colour study is pretty accurate. It sounds like the types of colours a herbivorous forest animal would need to stay camouflaged. I'm trying to think what else could have made those bite marks. I'm thinking if it is a bite mark, it probably was Sinocalliopteryx, which is known to have fed on ornithischians. However, it is possible that it may be from some intraspecific conflict, possibly over mates or territory? I agree, this is a fascinating find.

The important thing to understand about the bite marks is both biting and crushing, with a bite that was from an animal with two large canine like tusks. That would rule out an inter species quarrel with psittacosaurus having no such weapons I would assume

[Balaur]

Well, the paper was published in 2010, and when Tianyulong was found in 2010, it was thought to be from the early Cretaceous, before further research showed it was middle Jurassic. Also, I think heterodontosaurs are omnivorous, and wouldn't be surprised if it ate other dinosaurs. I think the colour study is pretty accurate. It sounds like the types of colours a herbivorous forest animal would need to stay camouflaged. I'm trying to think what else could have made those bite marks. I'm thinking if it is a bite mark, it probably was Sinocalliopteryx, which is known to have fed on ornithischians. However, it is possible that it may be from some intraspecific conflict, possibly over mates or territory? I agree, this is a fascinating find.

The important thing to understand about the bite marks is both biting and crushing, with a bite that was from an animal with two large canine like tusks. That would rule out an inter species quarrel with psittacosaurus having no such weapons I would assume

Hmmm... Maybe some heterodontosaurs did exist there then. Possibly.

[amargasaurus cazaui]

Some freebies for those that enjoy papers......
http://www.miketaylor.org.uk/tmp/papers/gmayr43.pdf


This first paper I have posted was partially motivated to provide it during a discussion recently that I had with another forum member regarding the quills Collecta insists on placing on their own ceratopsian models. I and Stargatedalek had both stated that this style of quills would be unlikely given the scale preservation we have for triceratops Lane, and I had further offered that the psittacosaurus with quills, actually had shafts for the quills that penetrated the skin level almost to the edge of the vert processes, whereas the proposed scales for Lane appeared to have a raised center which may have served as attachment for a single quill.In this paper you are given high resoloution pictures which demonstrate the quills in the psittacosaurus and how they are attached.





Bristle-like integumentary structures at the tail
of the horned dinosaur Psittacosaurus





http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/275/1636/775
A unique cross section through the skin of the dinosaurPsittacosaurus from China showing a complex fibre architecture

[amargasaurus cazaui]

Rather interesting paper about a Psittacosaur that survived some form of pathology and healed

https://app.box.com/s/iq83pr84r97aak50pshcq5jrfcczo464

[amargasaurus cazaui]

http://download1702.mediafire.com/0gtzp7g7qtkg/el8ip2isf496ii5/Structure+and+homology+of+Psittacosaurus+tail+bristles.pdf



The complete paper.  New paper studying psittacosaurus quills