David Peters

[MaastrichtianGuy]

Hate to play the role of backseat moderator, but are those books in the public domain? It's possible that Dr. Admin could get in trouble for hosting effectively pirated copies of these books.

the three books that are shown here are downloaded from his site as PDF so i download them in my iphone,took a snapshot of every page in every book,put them in the computer and then upload them straight to my photobucket account so there not pirated
http://www.davidpetersstudio.com/books.htm

[SBell]

Hate to play the role of backseat moderator, but are those books in the public domain? It's possible that Dr. Admin could get in trouble for hosting effectively pirated copies of these books.

the three books that are shown here are downloaded from his site as PDF so i download them in my iphone,took a snapshot of every page in every book,put them in the computer and then upload them straight to my photobucket account so there not pirated
http://www.davidpetersstudio.com/books.htm

I work in a university (as do many people here). It doesn't matter how you got them--unless these are public domain (doubtful, given their age) this is a potential copyright infringement that could come back to bite an admin or moderator in the butt. 'Pirated' doesn't equal 'copyright infringement'. It means using or making available the works of others without compensation.

Unless we have express permission from David Peters to use the images. Again, doubtful.

On another note, there is a 4th book--it's called Strange Creatures, and I have it. A mix of modern and prehistoric, including insects, dinosaurs, fishes, all sorts of things living and extinct.

[MaastrichtianGuy]

Hate to play the role of backseat moderator, but are those books in the public domain? It's possible that Dr. Admin could get in trouble for hosting effectively pirated copies of these books.

the three books that are shown here are downloaded from his site as PDF so i download them in my iphone,took a snapshot of every page in every book,put them in the computer and then upload them straight to my photobucket account so there not pirated
http://www.davidpetersstudio.com/books.htm

I work in a university (as do many people here). It doesn't matter how you got them--unless these are public domain (doubtful, given their age) this is a potential copyright infringement that could come back to bite an admin or moderator in the butt. 'Pirated' doesn't equal 'copyright infringement'. It means using or making available the works of others without compensation.

Unless we have express permission from David Peters to use the images. Again, doubtful.

On another note, there is a 4th book--it's called Strange Creatures, and I have it. A mix of modern and prehistoric, including insects, dinosaurs, fishes, all sorts of things living and extinct.

well im gonna post the pages of the 4th book Strange Creatures when i get the book to be scanned completely and transfer them into the computer

[Verahin]

Extremely cool paleoart on these books, are they still in print or the only way to get them is to track down second hand copies?

[MaastrichtianGuy]

Extremely cool paleoart on these books, are they still in print or the only way to get them is to track down second hand copies?

well for the first three books you can download them as pdf in his website or you can order them online if you want to. but for the last three books you can order them online but to make them as pdf you had to have them scanned then an email will show you scanned pages of the three books then you transfer it onto the computer

[Verahin]

well for the first three books you can download them as pdf in his website or you can order them online if you want to. but for the last three books you can order them online but to make them as pdf you had to have them scanned then an email will show you scanned pages of the three books then you transfer it onto the computer

I like the first two a lot, and yeah, looks like they're available for a free download on the author's website, so hardly any copyright infringement or piracy. I knew David Peters and the whole story about pterosaurs but never bothered to check his website, thanks for sharing.

[DinoToyForum]

Hate to play the role of backseat moderator, but are those books in the public domain? It's possible that Dr. Admin could get in trouble for hosting effectively pirated copies of these books.

The DTF registration agreement is quite clear that forum owner is not legally responsible for posted forum content (except for my own I posts). "You [the forum member] remain solely responsible for the content of your posted messages. Furthermore, you agree to indemnify and hold harmless the owners of this forum, any related websites to this forum, its staff, and its subsidiaries". Also, technically, the image host in this case is Photobucket, not Dinotoyblog. So, while I'm not endorsing whole books being posted on the forum, I'm not concerned about repercussions for me.

Re: back seat moderating, if you hate it, don't do it. Better to flag any issues you come across to me or another moderator, either by pm or using the reporting system provided. Thanks!

[MaastrichtianGuy]

Hate to play the role of backseat moderator, but are those books in the public domain? It's possible that Dr. Admin could get in trouble for hosting effectively pirated copies of these books.

The DTF registration agreement is quite clear that forum owner is not legally responsible for posted forum content (except for my own I posts). "You [the forum member] remain solely responsible for the content of your posted messages. Furthermore, you agree to indemnify and hold harmless the owners of this forum, any related websites to this forum, its staff, and its subsidiaries". Also, technically, the image host in this case is Photobucket, not Dinotoyblog. So, while I'm not endorsing whole books being posted on the forum, I'm not concerned about repercussions for me.

Re: back seat moderating, if you hate it, don't do it. Better to flag any issues you come across to me or another moderator, either by pm or using the reporting system provided. Thanks!

I called David Peters today I asked him for permission and he said all of his first three books are not available in stores anymore and are free for download in his site so if I pay him for these books he might have problems and if i don't he won't have any problems

[Mirroraptor]

David Peters is a good artist until today,but a terrible researcher.
but it doesn't matter-They looks cool,and also no evidence to show that these animals cannot have these organs(That's why he is a bad sci-worker-Notice that there is no way of disproving this statement and can't repeat them.).
I like to use Peters'pterosaurs in my painting,sculpting and novel,and I'll told everyone who watch them these is the personal opinion and not the truth.

[brontosauruschuck]

1. I remember checking both those first two books out from the library RELENTLESSLY when I was a kid. I've wanted to track them down for years abut I couldn't remember anything about them other than the name 'Gaints,' which isn't going to filter it down much on a search engine.

2. So I just heard about David Peters a bunch on science Twitter. Apparently he did some funny business after Jenny Clack died, and according to some people he's a real bad egg these days. I don't like getting mixed up in drama, but it sounds like he has some very interesting and unconventional ideas about zoology. https://twitter.com/SparrowLucero/status/1244544927817584641 https://twitter.com/TetZoo/status/1244378180305199104

[suspsy]

There's no "apparently" about it. Peters used Jenny Clack's death as an opportunity to preach his own nonsensical claims—claims which have NEVER held up to scrutiny. Darren is absolutely right to call him on it and I agree with every word in that screencap. I'd have said worse to Peters.

[SBell]

1. I remember checking both those first two books out from the library RELENTLESSLY when I was a kid. I've wanted to track them down for years abut I couldn't remember anything about them other than the name 'Gaints,' which isn't going to filter it down much on a search engine.

2. So I just heard about David Peters a bunch on science Twitter. Apparently he did some funny business after Jenny Clack died, and according to some people he's a real bad egg these days. I don't like getting mixed up in drama, but it sounds like he has some very interesting and unconventional ideas about zoology. https://twitter.com/SparrowLucero/status/1244544927817584641 https://twitter.com/TetZoo/status/1244378180305199104

"These days" is an understatement. He's positioned himself as an outacast and outsider for almost two decades now. His art is good, but his science is not.

[CityRaptor]

Wasn't he right regarding Oculudentavis? Of course that was by pure chance, but it should be a huge boost to his ego. 

[austrosaurus]

Wasn't he right regarding Oculudentavis? Of course that was by pure chance, but it should be a huge boost to his ego.

Unfortunately yes he was, and I get the feeling he's going to be riding the coattails of that one for a long time. For someone whose attitude to academia is much like Rumplestiltskin in Shrek 4 ("nobody's smart but me!"), he sure does love to strut around on the rare occasion he manages to find the same result as "Big Paleo".

I can't say I'm surprised he used Jenny's death as an opportunity to be as nasty and tasteless as possible; it's incredibly disappointing but it's very consistent with the messianic persecution complex he's constructed for himself over the past 20 or so years.

[ItsTwentyBelow]

Funny thread, I never knew about all the controversy around David Peters. That Twitter post is engrossing and telling.

I actually just the other day independently stumbled upon his site where his picture books are available to download in PDF, and definitely put those on my tablet for some visual fun. Never read them before, but it made me remember how much I loved flipping through my copies of "Supergiants!" and "Raptors!" as a kid (although his raptor paintings with the weird arm-flesh membranes never sat right with me at all). Luckily "Dino" Don Lessem actually wrote those two books. I'll always fondly look back on Peters' painting of Rodolfo Coria crouching to inspect some Argentinosaurus remains eroding out in "Supergiants!"

Fascinating to know what a rogue scientist Peters has become.

[suspsy]

Fascinating to know what a rogue scientist Peters has become.

For the record, Peters has no formal training or degree in paleontology; he's merely a talented artist who likes to pretend he's a scientist. It also bears noting that Peters never studies fossils in person; he simply examines whatever photographs he can find online and then jumps to his insane conclusions from there. Darren Naish has been warning people about him for years now:

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/tetrapod-zoology/world-must-ignore-reptileevolution-com/

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/vvb8kj/why-paleontologists-get-riled-up-over-this-heretical-pterosaur-concept-art

[Libraraptor]

Isn´t ignoring him the best way to cope with this matter? The things we feed most grow most, don´t they?

[austrosaurus]

Isn´t ignoring him the best way to cope with this matter? The things we feed most grow most, don´t they?

From an academic standpoint yes, but from a science communication standpoint it's a good thing that many accredited palaeontologists are now trying to generate negative press to counteract how ubiquitous he is on the internet. It's all well and good saying that we as enthusiasts and industry professionals should ignore his work, but a layperson is far more likely to stumble across his work than a published article, and his websites are so professional and his claims made with such unearned confidence that the average person won't be able to tell that they're basically un-science.

[suspsy]

I have yet to see evidence that ignoring peddlers of pseudoscience like Peters causes them to go silent or fade away. It certainly hasn't worked with climate deniers, anti-vaxxers, flat earthers, young earth creationists, or the dangerous individuals currently claiming that Covid-19 is either a hoax or no worse than the flu or the common cold. I think such problems need to be addressed with facts and knowledge. A @austrosaurus is dead on in his observations too.

[ITdactyl]

At the very least, his former unchallenged online presence made earnest science workers exert more effort with their own online reach/footprint.  Now we have more of them who engage not only with fellow academics but also with lay people.

It also led to the creation of the pterosaur.net and pteros.com websites to take some of the internet search spotlight off the pterosaur heresies blog.