PNSO: New for 2022

[Strepsodus]

I have already made up my mind on which Styracosaurus I'm going to buy, and I'm rather turned off of large T. rex-like theropods (especially ones that cost &42.99) at the time being, but the Centrosaurus looks good.

[CARN0TAURUS]

Paleofiguras posted more pictures and info on the Zhuchengtyrannus on their Facebook page. The price will be $42.99.

I still don't understand how they can turn a profit on a $22.99 Spinops but then charge $30-36 dollars for other Ceratopsians that are of smaller or comparable size like centrosaurus.  At least the medium size theropod price didn't go up again from 2021 prices.

Spinops was a few years ago. Completely different world today as far as economics goes, hard to really compare.

Yeah, but although the Spinops was originally released a few years ago, it is still in production today and selling for the same price, so they must still be making a profit off of it. If economics are the reason for the price change then the price of all figures currently in production should go up, I would think.

The vast majority of the cost of a figure is the initial tooling. If they already recouped the cost of the mold there's not much incentive to increase the price, the model has likely already paid for itself and the rest is profit. I would expect an increase in the near future to cover increased shipping costs, but PNSO tends to not wrap those up in the base price which is why shipping is often high and variable from seller to seller, the retailers are choosing to eat that cost (or not).

That makes sense, I'm not gonna pretend that I'm "in the know" regarding such things.

Edit: It's also entirely possible that the first few 2019 PNSO releases were already loss leaders designed to get people interested in the brand and didn't really make a profit anyway. Would be scummy business practice to get people hooked then jack up the price but not exactly uncommon.

Well, that does make one wonder.

I might on occasion complain about the prices but I'll also acknowledge PNSO's accomplishments.  For starters, in the last 3 years they have consistently produced so-called "definitive" versions of most of the species they have focused on.    And when they failed to create a fantastic figure they did not hesitate to go back to square one and make it better which is absolutely unheard of.  Most companies would just sit on a mold until it turned a profit and then long after that.  I don't know of any other company going on a run like this, like ever.  No one else except for Eofauna can even begin to claim that what they're producing is the best of that animal ever seen everytime out and Eofauna might not count because it's a small player and mostly produces the greatest prehistoric elephants anyone's ever produced.  Am I happy about the prices?  No, BUT, I'll continue to pay them as long as this level of quality is being maintained and simply because no one else can or is doing what PNSO is doing right now.  I still think Eofauna opened the door back with that Steppe Mammoth, PNSO's dinosaurs at that time were still not what they are now.  But once that door was opened PNSO not only ran thru it but they set the bar much much higher with quality but also by combining quality with volume.  It's a rare thing for a company to go with volume and still maintain this level of quality.  The closest thing I can compare to this is what Mattel is doing with the Jurassic Park toys which are consistently really really nice.   The completists may or may not be happy, but everyone that wants a lot to choose from stands to benefit.  I often hear people complain because they can't catch up to the releases, but where's is it written that we have to keep up?

So while I do question at times if their prices are excessive.  Do they really need to charge $45 for a 1/35 scale theropod to make back their expenses in new molds etc..?  I'm also pleased that they continue producing these mostly fantastic pieces.  These prices are like their version of "gofundme" or kickstarter and we are paying for ever increasing quality and volume of subjects.  As long as the money is going to continue molding new definitive versions of dinosaurs AND to perfect the not so definitive versions, what's the problem?  If they start sitting on their laurels and stop growing the herd then yes, I'm not going to pay for multiple repaint versions of the same molds over and over again.  But PNSO hasn't done that yet and they continue to deliver new and fresh at a rapid pace while maintaining a high standard of quality.  Once other companies start competing with them in terms of volume and quality then we'll see PNSO have to adjust their prices but by then their library of subjects will be so large and of such high caliber that they'll be able to sell older pieces at much lower rates than other folks.  They are setting themselves up to remain a powerhouse in this hobby for a very long time.  Already the name PNSO is becoming synonymous with prolific excellence.

[Gwangi]

I completely agree with all of that, which is why despite the often frustrating prices, I still collect PNSO. No one is doing what they're doing and while I've passed on quite a few of their more expensive figures they're still my favorite toy dinosaur producer. So, while I might be annoyed at the $35 Centrosaurus price tag...it's a Centrosaurus, and aside from the BotM, it's the only one and no company is likely to produce another, let alone one that's better than PNSO's. 

[Faelrin]

@CARN0TAURUS Those are some really interesting points you've made here. I've well been aware (and generally pleased) with how many species they've put out that have no other decent alternatives currently, but never really thought about the high price points as helping to cover the costs of production for current or future models, and obviously profit as well. The only issue I have with that though is that these seem to be cheaper in China, versus elsewhere, so the sudden hike could be attributed to something else possibly, like shipping costs etc? But again it is still weird older models still have the same cheaper prices like the Lambeosaurus, and have not had a price hike (+ the more detailed paint apps it has compared to some of these newer models as of late). Just why I wish there was more transparency on this front, but I'm well aware that won't happen either.

[Bread]

I complain about price points all the time. It is my only real issue with PNSO, but I still classify them as affordable for their product! There are indeed a few that strike me as overpriced, but the majority are excellent figures with decent price points. Now, I don't know how many of you collect their boxes and pamphlets that come with the figures, but if they could remove those and instead go to the Safar/CollectA route for packaging that would save them and us quite a bit of money.

[Bokisaurus]

@Carnotaurus thanks for taking the time to write what you said, it's something I have been wanting to do for a long time now but felt it's to no avail, so thanks.
I completely agree of the points you outlined.
We simply don't have a clue to make a fair judgment.

I also feel like there are some who are so determined to make PNSO as a villain.
Just because they repainted a couple of old models then then become so greedy!
So many of the brands do it all the time, heck even releasing multiple color variant of the same model to increase sales but they don't get labeled as greedy.
The truth is every single company that make all of these models we collect exists solely to make money.

And I don't understand why there are those who can't just appreciate that the older PNSO models that were priced under $25 are still selling at that price. Why does it have to be dissected and seen as another money making ploy? We should be thankful instead of criticizing.
Can you imagine if PNSO increased the price on those, just imagine how people will be so up in arms about it.🤷🏻‍♂️
In the end none of the brands are obligated to give us their reasoning on how they run their business.

It seems like some are just finding things to complain about PNSO while waiting for the next model to be released where it then will be nitpicked and crucified endlessly. Sigh.

[Faras]

I remember last year it took them a month to release figures again, I thought the Chinese new year would last a month, and that the Zhuchentyrannus was just a figure they managed to produce before that and only released now a bit late, for some reason.

@SenSx Official holidays usually start from the day day before CNY and last a week, factories may extend it to nearly two weeks. Though this year things were different - many shops and postal services didn't take new year break, I don't recall seeing this before.

These prices are like their version of "gofundme" or kickstarter and we are paying for ever increasing quality and volume of subjects.  As long as the money is going to continue molding new definitive versions of dinosaurs AND to perfect the not so definitive versions, what's the problem?

@CARN0TAURUS Well said, I completely agree with all points you made. Honestly with their new releases rate, PNSO defo need funds from previous sales for new molds.

The only issue I have with that though is that these seem to be cheaper in China, versus elsewhere, so the sudden hike could be attributed to something else possibly, like shipping costs etc?

@Faelrin Mainland prices for ceratopsians (￥79 Spinops/Pachyrhinosaurus/Machairoceratops -> ￥129 Centrosaurus/Styracosaurus)  went up by around 63%, which is bigger increase than global prices' 52%. So I guess hike in material costs and production costs etc played bigger roles since for majority of old figures, stocks before 2021 are still being sold.

--------------------

Hmm gonna do a quick calculation on how many pieces they need to sell to cover cost of new mold. Sorry for only including domestic numbers as I know little about costs for mass international shipping, custom taxs and total sales etc.

GRtoys' Quetzalcoatlus mold cost $5500 according to owner of the brand. Rumours (before global plastic and factory shortage) say material, postal, manpower costs etcs are about 50% of listed prices for domestic purchases.

So assume that:
1. Cost of mold is roughly $5500 across the broad.
2. For domestic sales: PNSO gain $5.5-13 for prehistoric line, $13-25 for museum line (minus additional shipping costs due to weight).
PS: in reality they gain 10%-30% less since majority only buy during sales. Expensive figures also use more materials, so profits could be less than 50%.

To cover initial costs, they need to sell ~423-1000 pcs (prehistoric line) or ~220-423 pcs (museum line) domestically.

Adding up total sales numbers (shame Tmall  only show rough counts like 100+, 200+) in their four official stores, figures roughly reaching or exceeding the goal are:

Prehistoric line
Megalodon 1381+
Carcharodontosaurus 1373+
Tarbosaurus 1298+
Ankylosaurus 1194+
Spinosaurus 799+
Yutyrannus 744+
Dunkleosteus 740+
Parasaurolophus 723+
Allosaurus 686+
Torvosaurus 676+
Pachyrhinosaurus 656+
Sinoceratops 601+
Qianzhousaurus 554+
Olorotitan 442+

Museum line
New Wilson the T. rex 1120+
New Mamenchisaurus 753+
New Triceratops 732+
Kronosaurus 696+
Old Wilson the T. rex 576+
Megalodon 546+
Giganotosaurus 432+
Old Mamenchisaurus 430+
Old Triceratops 425+ (or 725+ with 300 pcs limited version)

PNSO barely got half the cost of mold back for some of the cheap and less popular figures (some $22.99 ones and resin busts). tbh if they only produces toys they'd probably be bankrupted.

Edit: I used data from two shops on Tmall (links below with total sales), Modian crowdfunding and Pinduoduo official store (no web version, need to download smart phone app).
https://pnso.tmall.com/search.htm?spm=a1z10.3-b-s.w4011-21436938511.40.5d774f68YDHmrV&search=y&orderType=hotsell_desc&tsearch=y
https://pnsoynsd.tmall.com/category.htm?spm=a1z10.3-b.w4011-23966815817.36.6903db04LFa4QY&search=y&orderType=hotsell_desc

[Duna]

Thank you @Faras for such an interesting analysis and point of view.

I still remmember when I bought my first PNSO figure, the superb Ankylosaurus for 15€. I still think that price was only to catch people onto the brand (or whatever is called).

[RobinGoodfellow]

I also feel like there are some who are so determined to make PNSO as a villain.
Just because they repainted a couple of old models then then become so greedy!
So many of the brands do it all the time, heck even releasing multiple color variant of the same model to increase sales but they don't get labeled as greedy.
The truth is every single company that make all of these models we collect exists solely to make money.

And I don't understand why there are those who can't just appreciate that the older PNSO models that were priced under $25 are still selling at that price. Why does it have to be dissected and seen as another money making ploy? We should be thankful instead of criticizing.
Can you imagine if PNSO increased the price on those, just imagine how people will be so up in arms about it.🤷🏻‍♂️
In the end none of the brands are obligated to give us their reasoning on how they run their business.

It seems like some are just finding things to complain about PNSO while waiting for the next model to be released where it then will be nitpicked and crucified endlessly. Sigh.

Nowadays it seems that people on social medias/web  are only able of complaining and criticising everything and everyone. 
Really sad times. 

And thanks Faras for a good dose of reality and economy. 

[Psittacoraptor]

Thanks again @Faras for your insight.

Here are a couple of videos about the creation of some of the latest models. They're quite long and detailed (20/30+ minutes):

Triceratops Doyle:
https://youtu.be/7ndcl0n12OA
https://youtu.be/3Dg7EaOAk_M

Iguanodon Harvey:
https://youtu.be/rdRwW198s2U

Centrosaurus Jennie:
https://youtu.be/WmBOVGoqPjE

[SidB]

Thank you, @Psittacoraptor , for sending along these videos. I've wanted, in particular, to see the Iguanodon one for quite a while now, since I'd heard that, despite it's detailed explanation of how and why the PNSO team had arrived at its decisions to construct the figure in its released form, nothing was said about the choice of a very Mantellisaurus-like head for the other-wise totally iguanodon sculpt. Sure enough, nothing was mentioned, which is a little frustrating as, admittedly, I'm somewhat fixated on this issue. It seems that they are are essentially ignoring the earlier re-classification separating Mantellisaurus from Iguanodon. They seem quite aware of all of the recent research, so the omission of any mention of this apparent choice NOT to separate the two genera is surprising in view of the detailed explanation of the process of design decisions.

[Thialfi]

@Faras thanks for sharing those numbers! Very insightful. However, PNSO has a lot more outlets from where they sell, no? In my small country alone I know about three shops that sell their product.

[Sim]

I am pleased that PNSO are reading a Zhuchengtyrannus (which is definitely a valid taxon, unlike a certain other Tyrannosaur they've released). I can now finally sell my Fukui Museum Zhuchengtyrannus and Sinoceratops diorama. And this is a really nice figure, again, nicer than Wilson 2 which I will be replacing with the Beasts of the Mesozoic Tyrannosaurus WWD later.

I thought you'd be happy about this!  I'm now also considering replacing my Favorite Sinoceratops and Zhuchengtyrannus with the PNSO versions.  I'm not sure I prefer the PNSO versions though so I might not.  One thing that has stopped me getting the PNSO Sinoceratops is the weird bifurcated spikes on its frill.  Does anyone know if they are supported by any fossil?

I would not buy a Daspletosaurus from PNSO because I have the Safari, which has lips, and PNSO wouldn't give it lips so I will not replace it, one of the reasons I didn't get the PNSO Qianzhousaurus. I would consider Albertosaurus and Gorgosaurus though, but probably not both.

The Safari Daspletosaurus is D. torosus.  What if PNSO releases D. horneri or the Dinosaur Park Formation Daspletosaurus species?  They each have a different head.  Personally I'd like models of all three species.

[SRF]

What I was wondering, is there anything known about when the Zhuchengtyrannus is available for purchase?

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

What I was wondering, is there anything known about when the Zhuchengtyrannus is available for purchase?

Lana said soon on Facebook, I'd guess no later than Monday.

[Dinoburger]

Paleofiguras posted more pictures and info on the Zhuchengtyrannus on their Facebook page. The price will be $42.99.

I still don't understand how they can turn a profit on a $22.99 Spinops but then charge $30-36 dollars for other Ceratopsians that are of smaller or comparable size like centrosaurus.  At least the medium size theropod price didn't go up again from 2021 prices.

Spinops was a few years ago. Completely different world today as far as economics goes, hard to really compare.

Yeah, but although the Spinops was originally released a few years ago, it is still in production today and selling for the same price, so they must still be making a profit off of it. If economics are the reason for the price change then the price of all figures currently in production should go up, I would think.

The vast majority of the cost of a figure is the initial tooling. If they already recouped the cost of the mold there's not much incentive to increase the price, the model has likely already paid for itself and the rest is profit. I would expect an increase in the near future to cover increased shipping costs, but PNSO tends to not wrap those up in the base price which is why shipping is often high and variable from seller to seller, the retailers are choosing to eat that cost (or not).

That makes sense, I'm not gonna pretend that I'm "in the know" regarding such things.

Edit: It's also entirely possible that the first few 2019 PNSO releases were already loss leaders designed to get people interested in the brand and didn't really make a profit anyway. Would be scummy business practice to get people hooked then jack up the price but not exactly uncommon.

Well, that does make one wonder.

I might on occasion complain about the prices but I'll also acknowledge PNSO's accomplishments.  For starters, in the last 3 years they have consistently produced so-called "definitive" versions of most of the species they have focused on.    And when they failed to create a fantastic figure they did not hesitate to go back to square one and make it better which is absolutely unheard of.  Most companies would just sit on a mold until it turned a profit and then long after that.  I don't know of any other company going on a run like this, like ever.  No one else except for Eofauna can even begin to claim that what they're producing is the best of that animal ever seen everytime out and Eofauna might not count because it's a small player and mostly produces the greatest prehistoric elephants anyone's ever produced.  Am I happy about the prices?  No, BUT, I'll continue to pay them as long as this level of quality is being maintained and simply because no one else can or is doing what PNSO is doing right now.  I still think Eofauna opened the door back with that Steppe Mammoth, PNSO's dinosaurs at that time were still not what they are now.  But once that door was opened PNSO not only ran thru it but they set the bar much much higher with quality but also by combining quality with volume.  It's a rare thing for a company to go with volume and still maintain this level of quality.  The closest thing I can compare to this is what Mattel is doing with the Jurassic Park toys which are consistently really really nice.   The completists may or may not be happy, but everyone that wants a lot to choose from stands to benefit.  I often hear people complain because they can't catch up to the releases, but where's is it written that we have to keep up?

So while I do question at times if their prices are excessive.  Do they really need to charge $45 for a 1/35 scale theropod to make back their expenses in new molds etc..?  I'm also pleased that they continue producing these mostly fantastic pieces.  These prices are like their version of "gofundme" or kickstarter and we are paying for ever increasing quality and volume of subjects.  As long as the money is going to continue molding new definitive versions of dinosaurs AND to perfect the not so definitive versions, what's the problem?  If they start sitting on their laurels and stop growing the herd then yes, I'm not going to pay for multiple repaint versions of the same molds over and over again.  But PNSO hasn't done that yet and they continue to deliver new and fresh at a rapid pace while maintaining a high standard of quality.  Once other companies start competing with them in terms of volume and quality then we'll see PNSO have to adjust their prices but by then their library of subjects will be so large and of such high caliber that they'll be able to sell older pieces at much lower rates than other folks.  They are setting themselves up to remain a powerhouse in this hobby for a very long time.  Already the name PNSO is becoming synonymous with prolific excellence.

I cannot agree more. PNSO's sculpts and attention to detail and science puts them far ahead in my eyes- and well worth the price tag. I recently picked up the tylosaurus and I am blown away at the quality I received for $40. The level of detail is unsurpassed. Fine scales, muscle rippling, great paint, scientifically accurate...the list goes on.

I have more expensive models that aren't nearly as good.

I think we should support PNsO.

[SidB]

D @Dinoburger , agreed.

[Over9K]

The Zhuchengtyrannus pose does not inspire confidence that it can stand without the support rod, even momentarily for a photo. I guess we'll see once it's in hand with a few folks...

I'm ok with needing the support rod for long term display, but dependence on the rod to stand at all is just not pukka.

[SRF]

The Zhuchengtyrannus pose does not inspire confidence that it can stand without the support rod, even momentarily for a photo. I guess we'll see once it's in hand with a few folks...

I'm ok with needing the support rod for long term display, but dependence on the rod to stand at all is just not pukka.

Paleofiguras posted in hand pictures of the Zhuchengtyrannus and it stands perfectly fine without the support. Difficult to share them here right now since I'm on my phone but this figure looks very good and seems very stable.

[Skorpio V.]

Oh no. This is too good!



And obligatory comparison shots (missing Wilson comparison but still )



Very happy with the keratin on the head that were just scales for Wilson. Shame they gave it the Gamba treatment by slapping a primary colour over it with little rhyme or reason. The body paint looks fantastic though!