Re: Marvel Avengers discussion

[SBell]

amargasaurus cazaui, I believe the Marvel thing has to do with the fact that Black Widow merchandise for Avengers: Age of Ultron was...lacking, to say the least.

That is, indeed, what I meant--how, exactly, are kids supposed to build their Avengers Team when they are missing both Black Widow and Scarlet Witch (Spoiler? I guess? It's been long enough)?

So we just don't bother.

But...the Black Widow figure is offered in both the smaller sized figures by Hasbro and the Legends series....I just did not care for either ...I am not sure where thats coming from?An ebay search would show the same thing......so I am unsure what the problem is here. I do admit that compared to the Hulk or Thor the females get far less dedicated merchandise for sure though. Same for scarlet witch...figures in both formats./..I even purchased the Legends series Scarlet.

I am only concerning myself with the movies. That is our frame of reference, and the most public one. Ones based on the comics, etc don't count because their market is different.

But there is more going on--for example, one of the coolest scenes in AoU is when BW drops out of a motorcycle from the bottom of a jet to hellp Captain America--according to lego, she was the pilot and CA was...driving off to save himself. In the main line of toys, CA is driving the bike, and the pilot isn't visible (although, having just looked, I notice that some newer figures have been created--including a Hawkeye, which was also left out originally!).

[amargasaurus cazaui]

amargasaurus cazaui, I believe the Marvel thing has to do with the fact that Black Widow merchandise for Avengers: Age of Ultron was...lacking, to say the least.

That is, indeed, what I meant--how, exactly, are kids supposed to build their Avengers Team when they are missing both Black Widow and Scarlet Witch (Spoiler? I guess? It's been long enough)?

So we just don't bother.

But...the Black Widow figure is offered in both the smaller sized figures by Hasbro and the Legends series....I just did not care for either ...I am not sure where thats coming from?An ebay search would show the same thing......so I am unsure what the problem is here. I do admit that compared to the Hulk or Thor the females get far less dedicated merchandise for sure though. Same for scarlet witch...figures in both formats./..I even purchased the Legends series Scarlet.

I am only concerning myself with the movies. That is our frame of reference, and the most public one. Ones based on the comics, etc don't count because their market is different.

But there is more going on--for example, one of the coolest scenes in AoU is when BW drops out of a motorcycle from the bottom of a jet to hellp Captain America--according to lego, she was the pilot and CA was...driving off to save himself. In the main line of toys, CA is driving the bike, and the pilot isn't visible (although, having just looked, I notice that some newer figures have been created--including a Hawkeye, which was also left out originally!).

Right and thats fine...just using the toys released for the movie, there are STILL in both the Legends series and the regular action figure lines...figures of both the characters you mentioned in a few formats at least....I own the Scarlet Witch from the Age of Ultron Legends series, and just saw the the smaller action figure yesterday for her. The Black Widow was part of a Legend Series previously , perhaps as the movie released, and she has always been part of the smaller line, for the movie again. Perhaps its more to do with either where you are shopping of what they are stocking? I can say these are all readily availible in the local wal mart where I live.

[docronnie]

You're both lucky. Here in our country, you can't easily get those Legends at the toy stores. We could only easily get them from scalpers or specialty stores.

[SBell]

It's honestly not something I plan to ever buy. But I look at it this way--when actors from AoU are publicly lamenting about how it's so hard to find direct tie-in merchandise featuring their cast members, something is amiss.

Specifically, that parent overlord Disney is setting up Marvel as their 'boy line' to complement their very successful 'princesses' for girls. They look at it as having two separate markets and aren't all that concerned with any overlap.

The key is movie tie-in, the only thing I know of the Marvel Universe; all the other lines are for comic book fans.

But, again, not exactly something I would buy anyway. We have enough toys, and I don't have any particular emotions toward anything comic related. Which is why I am amused that I am apparently the progenitor of a thread in which I have no particular stake and probably won't revisit.

[amargasaurus cazaui]

It's honestly not something I plan to ever buy. But I look at it this way--when actors from AoU are publicly lamenting about how it's so hard to find direct tie-in merchandise featuring their cast members, something is amiss.

Specifically, that parent overlord Disney is setting up Marvel as their 'boy line' to complement their very successful 'princesses' for girls. They look at it as having two separate markets and aren't all that concerned with any overlap.

The key is movie tie-in, the only thing I know of the Marvel Universe; all the other lines are for comic book fans.

But, again, not exactly something I would buy anyway. We have enough toys, and I don't have any particular emotions toward anything comic related. Which is why I am amused that I am apparently the progenitor of a thread in which I have no particular stake and probably won't revisit.

Been a comic collector since the mid eighties and have some of the most sought after books in the comic marketplace today....gained alot of insight as I have gone as well. I dont see any hidden agenda or anything of the sort here myself, being much more familiar with the history and story of how and why.
  Avengers were originally formed by Hulk, Iron Man, Thor, Ant Man, and Wasp. There was one female member to begin with, period. Also, Captain America did not become a member until issue 4....so you can then use simple history to understand and explain why and what...Thor and Hulk were two of the original comics released by Marvel, Captain America dates back to 1941....Ant Man was one of the early titles as well being introduced in a ten cent cover price issue of Tales to Astonish. Wasp was later introduced in issue 44 of that same title. Then consider Hawkeye, who was introduced much later, in Tales of Suspense 57, Vision who was introduced much later in Avengers 57, or even Black Widow, who was not introduced until issue 52 of Tales of Suspense. Scarlet witch was introduced later as well..not appearing till issue 4 of the X-men. Continuing this thought , Captain America had his own title in the golden age and silver age...Thor, Hulk, Iron man, all had their own silver age titles as well. Note ...Vision, Hawkeye, Wasp, Scarlet Witch, Black Widow, .....none of these characters was ever a leading character in the silver age...and even well into the modern age, none of them managed solo titles, even through the entire bronze age of comics. Now , jump to the present...and think carefully before producing tie ins and merchandise...you can manufacture and build your line around characters that have more than fifty years of solid public fandom, or gamble with characters who have been guest stars, fill-ins and secondary runner ups mostly until the eighties if not later. If I am making that call it has zero to do with male or female, and everything to do with the solid sales that names like Hulk, Iron man, Thor and captain america personnify. It is all cyclical........before the Marvel powerhouse characters the ruling comic legends were Superman, Batman, Flash and Captain Marvel. In fact when Marvel first began, the Hulk was such a poor seller as a character his regular title was ended after just six issues...while the big names, Batman, superman and Captain Marvel were the kings of the comic world. Perhaps in thirty years or so when characters like Black Widow, and Scarlet witch have the same fan identification level as the old school Marvel legends they too will be considered key characters.
      All that aside, I have always liked the Black Widow character, but I can tell you another problem is that the Black Widow you see in the AoU is not even close to the original in costume, abilities or intent. They share the same name and that is about all.....this newer incarnation of the character dates to perhaps the seventies earliest....and the iconic character Scarlet Witch, is quite different and much more flamboyant in costume and character than what is used for AoU.
   Even then, Marvel has produced Age of Ultron Figures for each and every character, from Nick Fury to Scarlet Witch. They have also produced their Legends series, Age of Ultron with these same characters. BOTH lines are movie tie ins and were released alongside the movie. The thing that does present itself as obvious however is you can buy five variants of the Hulk, Iron and Cap...while Scarlet and the rest only got a single figure each. I know there are others in the forum for instance that collect the Legends series and can state that as well. I see these toys everyday , myself and know they are there . I think money has far more to do with it than any idea of princess lines and boys lines or anything of the sort....Captain American first appeared in comics in 1941....74 solid years of stories and toys and tie ins. I understand why he would get more merchandise than a character created in the early seventies..its just common sense.

[docronnie]

Enjoyed your post amargasaurus. I only collect the comic based Legends figures, Avengers in particular, but not all of them.

l just go with the flow with the movies, but don't bother much about the stories, which most of us Marvel fans got disappointed in the beginning. So, acceptance is the solution and keep the comic based stories intact. :-)

[amargasaurus cazaui]

Enjoyed your post amargasaurus. I only collect the comic based Legends figures, Avengers in particular, but not all of them.

l just go with the flow with the movies, but don't bother much about the stories, which most of us Marvel fans got disappointed in the beginning. So, acceptance is the solution and keep the comic based stories intact. :-)

I dont really work the sets as a completist, I get the figures I like and let the rest sit. I did grab the AoU Legends series Hulk figure, I just liked it and how it was made. My collecting is almost entirely these days centered around Marvel twelve cent covers, superhero, from 1965-1969 and fine or better condition. I am experimenting with hoarding these books and selling them in ten years to get myself a house. I locked up 24 comics from the fifites and sixties, which are my retirement and I am happy to say they are doing quite well according to the market .
    I really dropped out of new book reading and collecting when the multi cover,hologram, limited die cut, laser embossed , 3D special send in, type flood hit the market. I strictly purchase silver age material now and often in multiples.....as I am primarily investing . My pick of the old keys to watch right now would be Tales to Astonish # 27, first ant man, and also beware the Incredible Hulk #1 has quietly eased itself in the lead position fo scarcity in silver age marvel keys. I do have a thread somewhere in the forum here regarding silver age comics...which has been primarily Postie and I comparing collections.....if you like that sort of stuff. he has an amazing collection for sure !!!

[pylraster]

Me too. I don't collect the entire waves, not even the BAFs. Kind of getting sick of the Bucky Cap mold being reused on so many figures. Though Spider-Men/Women are awesome. My legends collection is more of Spider-Verse than other Marvel.

[docronnie]

I have contemplated many times to sell my Thor collection or my ML Avengers collection, but couldn't do it, due to sentimental reasons. These collections have been featured in toy & comic convention displays, movie promotion, magazine and television.

But who knows, one day I'll surely quit. :-)