Model kit makers (was Re: Galileo Out of Business?)

[Roktman]

I thought it might be helpful if I reposted this...

I over the years have had a number of bad experiences when purchasing dinosaur model kits or buildup services. (My most recent one was especially bad - the seller amongst other things by his own eventual admission lied about sending the kit I'd ordered.) So, I wanted to share some thoughts about avoiding such experiences and actions you can take if you do have them. I hope the information will be helpful to others, and would very much welcome any additional ideas that you might have.

To avoid running into trouble in the first place...(snip)

One other important thing to note for people new the garage kit hobby is that most of these sculptors/producers are doing this part time in what spare time they have. They don't have secretaries sitting on the end of their chairs waiting for you to email or call them. Their real jobs, family etc., rightly come first.  And in this economic times who to say they are not scrambling for every real $$ they can get. Selling dinosaur kits to us is not making them wealthy. Very rarely do they even make a profit. They are doing it for the love of the hobby.

While we would all like an email  back quickly and out kit mailed out the next day. It's not realistic to think that way.
For ex. Galileo's website went down, does that mean his email was down too? We don't know. Could be...  And as he said he was busy relocating his studio, and hiring more help -  that seems good reason to me for the lack of communication. He's communicating now and I'm sure orders will get filled.
Until they each win the Lotto and have no money worries so they can open a factory casting kits 24 hr's a day - Patience is the name of the game.   If we can't or don't want to wait maybe we need to find dinosaurs to paint elsewhere.

[dgmilner]

Some valid points to be sure, and I am very sympathetic - and grateful - to the people who create these kits. However, I have experienced all of the following:

* taking six months to two years to send a kit after saying it would be sent within a few weeks and providing no unsolicited updates or reason(s) for the delay
* simply ignoring requests for information about causes of delays
* not responding to e-mail at all
* sending a kit only after pressure has been brought to bear - the filing of a PayPal claim or involvment of some other third party
* lying about sending a kit
* not sending a kit at all and refusing to refund money

These are irresponsible acts simply not necessitated by limited time or money. Sending an e-mail, for exmaple, takes only a few moments and costs nothing extra.

I thought it might be helpful if I reposted this...

I over the years have had a number of bad experiences when purchasing dinosaur model kits or buildup services. (My most recent one was especially bad - the seller amongst other things by his own eventual admission lied about sending the kit I'd ordered.) So, I wanted to share some thoughts about avoiding such experiences and actions you can take if you do have them. I hope the information will be helpful to others, and would very much welcome any additional ideas that you might have.

To avoid running into trouble in the first place...(snip)

One other important thing to note for people new the garage kit hobby is that most of these sculptors/producers are doing this part time in what spare time they have. They don't have secretaries sitting on the end of their chairs waiting for you to email or call them. Their real jobs, family etc., rightly come first.  And in this economic times who to say they are not scrambling for every real $$ they can get. Selling dinosaur kits to us is not making them wealthy. Very rarely do they even make a profit. They are doing it for the love of the hobby.

While we would all like an email  back quickly and out kit mailed out the next day. It's not realistic to think that way.
For ex. Galileo's website went down, does that mean his email was down too? We don't know. Could be...  And as he said he was busy relocating his studio, and hiring more help -  that seems good reason to me for the lack of communication. He's communicating now and I'm sure orders will get filled.
Until they each win the Lotto and have no money worries so they can open a factory casting kits 24 hr's a day - Patience is the name of the game.   If we can't or don't want to wait maybe we need to find dinosaurs to paint elsewhere.

[tyrantqueen]

I thought it might be helpful if I reposted this...

I over the years have had a number of bad experiences when purchasing dinosaur model kits or buildup services. (My most recent one was especially bad - the seller amongst other things by his own eventual admission lied about sending the kit I'd ordered.) So, I wanted to share some thoughts about avoiding such experiences and actions you can take if you do have them. I hope the information will be helpful to others, and would very much welcome any additional ideas that you might have.

To avoid running into trouble in the first place...(snip)

One other important thing to note for people new the garage kit hobby is that most of these sculptors/producers are doing this part time in what spare time they have. They don't have secretaries sitting on the end of their chairs waiting for you to email or call them. Their real jobs, family etc., rightly come first.  And in this economic times who to say they are not scrambling for every real $$ they can get. Selling dinosaur kits to us is not making them wealthy. Very rarely do they even make a profit. They are doing it for the love of the hobby.

While we would all like an email  back quickly and out kit mailed out the next day. It's not realistic to think that way.
For ex. Galileo's website went down, does that mean his email was down too? We don't know. Could be...  And as he said he was busy relocating his studio, and hiring more help -  that seems good reason to me for the lack of communication. He's communicating now and I'm sure orders will get filled.
Until they each win the Lotto and have no money worries so they can open a factory casting kits 24 hr's a day - Patience is the name of the game.   If we can't or don't want to wait maybe we need to find dinosaurs to paint elsewhere.

Those are valid points, but I would also like to say that in extreme cases, there is really no excuse. Btw, I contacted Galileo a few days after I got the news about his moving to a new studio, and no response. In fact I sent 2 emails. Doesn't seem like he's communicating to me.

I never expected my kit to be dispatched the very next day. I do expect some kind of communication (where I don't have to wait weeks for a reply) I never even got my money back.
And if they have such busy lives, why sell model kits in the first place? Modelling isn't a charity, I do expect to receive what I paid for at the end of the day.

[radman]

Many good points made by both sides here.  Yes, it is frustrating to wait for weeks or months for your models or to even receive any communication.  Yes, most of these artists do this on the side from their day jobs and barely make any money at it anyway.

My experiences with Malcolm/Dinonikes, Galileo, Jon Rader and David Krentz have all been experiments with patience, HOWEVUH, eventually I did always get my orders, and usually some freebies to make up for any delays.  If you want/need prompt communication/shipping, order directly through Dansdinosaurs.com, he's the best and will let you know right away if something is or is not in stock.  Artists not affiliated with Dan, like Galileo, well, be prepared to wait, that's just the way it is. 

Professional artists that actually do this modeling stuff for a living that I can recommend are:
Cliff Green   http://cliffgreenstudio.net/gallery/index.html  (love the Prognathadon that Martin painted for me)
Shane Foulkes   http://www.triunecommunications.com/cc/index.html (my avatar is his Tarbosaurus)
Sean Cooper    http://www.paleocraft.com/Catalog.html  (Prehistoric mammals?  This is the place)

All of these guys will get back to you within a day or two, by my experience.
Good luck, and happy modeling and painting!

[tyrantqueen]

My experiences with Malcolm/Dinonikes, Galileo, Jon Rader and David Krentz have all been experiments with patience, HOWEVUH, eventually I did always get my orders, and usually some freebies to make up for any delays.  If you want/need prompt communication/shipping, order directly through Dansdinosaurs.com, he's the best and will let you know right away if something is or is not in stock.  Artists not affiliated with Dan, like Galileo, well, be prepared to wait, that's just the way it is.

Or, in Galileo's case, receive nothing at all.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Paypal gives you around a month if I recall. You shouldn't wait longer than that...and neither should it take longer than that to get something, even over seas. I know one case where an artist did keep up communication  only to run his customer's over the date then nada.

So pay by paypal , give them to the last minute, then file a claim if needed. Simple.

[amargasaurus cazaui]

I guess for me it comes down to, just do not have the funds or mental facilities to handle tossing the dice with my dinosaur hobby. If I cannot purchase something with a fairly decent expectation of getting it, then I need to purchase something more likely to arrive at my doorstep. I might be overly cautious in this regard, but times are tight and purchasing a dinosaur model should not be a cat and mouse game that involves waiting, delays, and such. I somewhat agree with a previous poster, that asked..why market model kits if your life is such you cannot deliver or are unable to come through? Nothing is gained for anyone by that. I too agree at purchasing items for my dinosaur hobby is not a charity, and at the end of the day I expect to get what I agreed to purchase and spent my hard earned funds for.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Some cases, like Josh Hoover, weren't because he wasn't ready for it, it was because he made too many deals and then spent the money for the models before it was done on bills and such. Then he was over his head owing thousands in pieces and couldn't come through because he needed money for supplies and refunds weren't an option because they money was spent. 

There are all types..I've run into bad guys, good guys and great guys..there is no one set rule.  The hard thing is when someone is selling something you want and you want to support them by buying their items..but do you take the chance ? 

I stand by my above statement, have a time frame in place, no longer than a month, if there is an issue pay by paypal so you have an option to at least get your money back.  It sounds harsh, but that way as a buyer you can feel safer about how your money is spent.

[Seijun]

Paypal gives you around a month if I recall. You shouldn't wait longer than that...and neither should it take longer than that to get something, even over seas. I know one case where an artist did keep up communication  only to run his customer's over the date then nada.

So pay by paypal , give them to the last minute, then file a claim if needed. Simple.

Some overseas shipping methods can take longer than a month. I know there is a very cheap "ground" method from the UK to the USA which take about 2 months.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Paypal gives you around a month if I recall. You shouldn't wait longer than that...and neither should it take longer than that to get something, even over seas. I know one case where an artist did keep up communication  only to run his customer's over the date then nada.

So pay by paypal , give them to the last minute, then file a claim if needed. Simple.

Some overseas shipping methods can take longer than a month. I know there is a very cheap "ground" method from the UK to the USA which take about 2 months.

You mean like SAL ? The post office told me a few months ago they no longer offer shipping by land and boat and their cheapest option would take less than a month now. Maybe the fellow didn't know as much as he let on.. :/

Still I would pay more for a quicker shipping option to keep in the paypal time frame.

[Seijun]

It was quite a while ago that I had something shipped that way. If things have changed recently, it would have been after I used that service.

[krentz]

To whomever makes their own kits and does their own shipping but is too busy to fill Odets in a timely fashion ( like me). I say this.  Wholesale. Let someone else take care of it. I've sold more through Dan and Urzeitshop than doing it on my own because I wanted all the profit. Thier good business practice will ensure more orders and more time for you to create. Best thing I've done !
DK

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

To whomever makes their own kits and does their own shipping but is too busy to fill Odets in a timely fashion ( like me). I say this.  Wholesale. Let someone else take care of it. I've sold more through Dan and Urzeitshop than doing it on my own because I wanted all the profit. Thier good business practice will ensure more orders and more time for you to create. Best thing I've done !
DK

Sound advice David !

[raderstudios]

To whomever makes their own kits and does their own shipping but is too busy to fill Odets in a timely fashion ( like me). I say this.  Wholesale. Let someone else take care of it. I've sold more through Dan and Urzeitshop than doing it on my own because I wanted all the profit. Thier good business practice will ensure more orders and more time for you to create. Best thing I've done !
DK

For my part, this is exactly what I am working on right now.  I have sent my recent models (Sue, Kaprosuchus and Ceratosaurus) to the talented hands of Mike Evans for casting, and he will be drop shipping orders for me as soon as the castings are ready.  This is how I intend to move forward with RaderStudios.

To anyone who is frustrated with me, please accept my humblest apologies, and please know that I will do whatever I can to take care of you when I get my business back on track.

-Jon

[Joel]

To whomever makes their own kits and does their own shipping but is too busy to fill Odets in a timely fashion ( like me). I say this.  Wholesale. Let someone else take care of it. I've sold more through Dan and Urzeitshop than doing it on my own because I wanted all the profit. Thier good business practice will ensure more orders and more time for you to create. Best thing I've done !
DK

For my part, this is exactly what I am working on right now.  I have sent my recent models (Sue, Kaprosuchus and Ceratosaurus) to the talented hands of Mike Evans for casting, and he will be drop shipping orders for me as soon as the castings are ready.  This is how I intend to move forward with RaderStudios.

To anyone who is frustrated with me, please accept my humblest apologies, and please know that I will do whatever I can to take care of you when I get my business back on track.

-Jon

Whoo-hoo! I can't wait to get my Kaprosuchus! On a related note, do you have any plans to finish the Sacrosuchus, or is the project on an indefinite hiatus?

[DinoToyForum]

Admin - The Galileo thread was going off topic and becoming broader in scope so I've split it into a new one. I did consider merging this with the Advice For Kit Buyers thread (http://www.dinotoyblog.com/forum/index.php/topic,397.0.html) but the discussion seemed different enough to warrant a separate thread altogether. Please carry on! 

[radman]

Galileo (geenemodels.com) has dropped prices on most models by ~30%!  I couldn't pass this up, and promptly ordered the Suchomimus kit.  He also got back to me within a day, and let me know the Saurolophus kit should be available in about a week, so that's something else to look forward to.

[Argentavis]

Yesterday i received my 1/48 scale T.Rex from Galileo. The stamp on the package says 08.02. (second august), it needs much time from Mexico to Germany/Europe.

If you are interested i can post a few pics of the kit in the "dinosaur kits" forum.

[radman]

Yesterday i received my 1/48 scale T.Rex from Galileo. The stamp on the package says 08.02. (second august), it needs much time from Mexico to Germany/Europe.

If you are interested i can post a few pics of the kit in the "dinosaur kits" forum.

Yes please. 

[tyrantqueen]

Looks like the Barosaurus vs Allosaurus models are back in stock too

I would love that kit but I have promised myself I will never order from him again.