velociraptor advice

[stargatedalek]

Sorry if this is the wrong place to ask

I'm working on a velociraptor design (possibly for use in light novel) and I want to be as accurate as possible so I have a few questions

-environment
I've heard a few different answers ranging from desert to temperate forest, so a general consensus (or something conclusive) would be great

-colouration
I'm thinking black, but would this make sense given the habitat and nocturnal hunting?

-feathering feet
if it did live in a desert or similar environment could feathered feet help to deal with hot sand?

[Gryphoceratops]

From what I understand Velociraptor lived in an environment that was mostly dry desert.  There were probably scattered areas which had more plants and water but you really can't go wrong making its habitat arid desert. 

As for color, you can really do whatever and get away with it but all black doesn't really mean good nocturnal coloration.  In fact, many nocturnal animals have really good camouflage coloration to hide themselves when they sleep during the day when they are most vulnerable. (think owls and ocelots off the top of my head)  That being said, good colors for a desert hunter can always be sandy tones with countershading (darker on top, lighter/white on bottom).  You could also throw darker or black markings in there too especially around the eyes and tips of the feathers.  Black markings near an animal's eyes help with glare from harsh sun (think oryx and cheetah for two examples off the top of my head or even baseball players)  Black coloration on feathers actually makes them more durable against abrasion and light.  Something about melanins make a feather tougher.  If you think about it you will notice that dark-colored primaries or feathers with dark tips (the part most exposed and likely to take a beating) is very common amongst birds especially in harsh environments. 

Feathers on the feet is up to you.  I get what you are thinking certain desert mammals like Fennec Fox have furred bottoms to protect them from the hot sand but tough scales on a dinosaur foot might be just fine.  Desert birds that I can think of off the top of my head don't have feathers on the feet.  (roadrunners come to mind as a decent analog to a velociraptor) As far as I know most dinosaurs that have proven to have had feathered lower legs and feet were more arboreal.  They would probably get dirty and hold the animal back when moving around on the ground.  It could be defended either way though. 

Hope that helps good luck with your story.

[HD-man]

-environment
I've heard a few different answers ranging from desert to temperate forest, so a general consensus (or something conclusive) would be great

-colouration
I'm thinking black, but would this make sense given the habitat and nocturnal hunting?

See the Lambert quote for both environment & coloration.

Quoting Lambert ( http://www.amazon.com/DK-Guide-Dinosaurs-David-Lambert/dp/0789452375/ref=la_B001HO76IC_1_13?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1405393419&sr=1-13 ):

With the agile, predatory lifestyle of a cat, Velociraptor might have had catlike camouflage to help it hide while it crept up on prey. Tigers have black stripes to hide in grass, but there was no grass in Velociraptor's time so this pattern seems unlikely. Lizardlike green skin is even more far-fetched because Velociraptor lived in a desert and vegetation was sparse. A more likely possibility is pale skin with dark blotches, like a leopard. A light, dusty color would have matched the surroundings, and spots would have broken up its outline and helped it hide in dappled shade under shrubs.

[stargatedalek]

thanks for the advice guys

-desert it is!

-I think I'll use feathered feet, but I've not entirely decided yet

-black feathers are more durable (don't forget those quill knobs), so assuming it was a high speed runner I'll use black for wing feathers (and any other areas that would stick out)

-for the bulk of the feathers I'm undecided, black markings are a safe bet, especially around the eyes, but for the bulk I think I'll go with light grey or white

thanks so much for the help, any further advice is appreciated

[laticauda]

There are many different styles, colors and use of bird feathers out there.  The questions is, what do you want your velociraptor to represent.  A aggressive stalker, ambush predator, or a colorful bird of paradise.

In the desert, the feathers would probably be longer and course, to protect itself from the wind.  Also look at the way roadrunners and Ostrich run, it will give you an interesting visual on what it might look like moving on the ground. 
Good Luck. 

[stargatedalek]

I'm going more for an aggressive stalker, something akin to a roadrunner

thanks, when I start working on poses I'll be sure to watch some video to have it fresh in my mind


I'm going to have stages for the initial concept demo, skeletal reconstruction, flesh reconstruction, and then life (feathered) reconstruction. I'll probably also include a scale, and possibly some variations of the life reconstruction(s). I'm making them in a scale vector format, so I can resize and adjust as desired without worrying about distortions. Because I'm rescaling them frequently I need to retrace the skeletal diagram into a vector file.

heres a WIP screenshot before I hit the bed, I would have just got the raptors but its getting late and I didn't feel up to cropping it, sorry
-fleshed ('plucked') version, I'll use it as a base for feathered version(s)
-skeletal is WIP (will not be neon green when finished)
-full credit for skeletal reference by Scot Hartman
-please ignore the vocaloid, I didn't make her shes my desktop background (there are two screens for the one PC, which is why it looks odd)

[stargatedalek]

another WIP, this time with feathers

[stargatedalek]

heres another WIP, I'm skeptical that I got the hind legs and tail right, so I'd like a second opinion on them before I add wings and patterns

[fabricious]

Personally, I don't think that feathers on the hind legs (the black ones) would have been this prominent, meaning that along with the elongation of the legs, they would most likely have turned to a more 'fuzzy', fur-like state, like on the back. You could look at emus and ostriches for this (seeing as they only have fuzzy feathers on their overall bodies). Stiff, pronounced feathers like this would need a reason (form follows function in nature ).

Other than that it is a nice concept, maybe you should make the eye a little bit smaller, it looks a bit like its popping out of the socket. I'm curious to see the finished version, keep it up!

[stargatedalek]

it may have been the flesh around the eye making it seem larger, i changed it to dark grey, does it help?

-feathers reduced on hind limbs
-body bulked up
-wing is not final, just getting the basic shape

[stargatedalek]

-bulked up tail and neck slightly
-finished(?) wing
-added further stripes
-trying negative space to show limb contour

[Scipionyx]

The wings should essentially look like this. Take note of where the feathers attach and the shape of the wing.

About the neck - feathers do not only make the outline of the neck bigger, they completely change the shape of the neck. Any curves in the neck are cancelled out by the feathers around it, making the neck always look straight (which is why some birds appear to have magically extendable necks)

This Bepiaosaurus fossil shows it really well. The outline of the neck created by the feathers is straight, even though the actual neck below them is curved.

Green heron showing the 'periscope' neck. From this blog post: http://willoughbyart.blogspot.com.au/2012/07/the-neck-is-lie.html which I also suggest you read.

Looking at colouration of animals that lived in a similar habitat to Velociraptor is important to find out what colouration is plausible for it. As HD-man quoted, mottled brown or something similar to modern desert-living animals (which are almost always brown in some way) would be a good guess. Black-and-white plumage like that would make the animal extremely visible, making camouflage impossible, and is pretty unlikely.

[stargatedalek]

- thanks, I'll work on reshaping the wing
- I was trying to show the neck extended, I'll be sure to keep that in mind for other poses
- I based it off roadrunner colouration, which varies from white/brown to white/black*, so I went with light grey/black, the grey was similar to a lot of desert sands I've seen, but of course this varies by region

* http://www.factzoo.com/sites/all/img/birds/cuckoo/roadrunner-poised.jpg
http://birds.audubon.org/sites/default/files/imagecache/bird-full/species_images/Greater_Roadrunner_b13-45-102_l_1.jpg

[stargatedalek]

this is the possibly final design concept (unless theres any more suggestions?)
-fixed(?) wing shape
-added more patterns

[Concavenator]

I'd choose an entirely black coloration because dromaeosaurs were most nocturnal.Velociraptor too.So a black coloration would make sense.

[stargatedalek]

that was my initial concept, but that would make it vulnerable (to both predation and overheating) during the day

[Concavenator]

that was my initial concept, but that would make it vulnerable (to both predation and overheating) during the day

I don't kniw what predators hunted on Velociraptor,but at least you can use a little black,more than that stripes.White coloration was also possible.I might draw a Velociraptor with a suggestion for the colors one of these days. 
I personally think Velociraptor was more birdlike than your interpretation,but that's just me.
It looks good so far though.If you're still looking for a pose,I'd reccomend you the second option.

[tyrantqueen]

I'd choose an entirely black coloration because dromaeosaurs were most nocturnal.Velociraptor too.So a black coloration would make sense.

Actually very few nocturnal animals are pure black. Most of them are dull, light colours, like the barn owl, which is white and light brown.

[Concavenator]

I'd choose an entirely black coloration because dromaeosaurs were most nocturnal.Velociraptor too.So a black coloration would make sense.

Actually very few nocturnal animals are pure black. Most of them are dull, light colours, like the barn owl, which is white and light brown.

But a barn owl can climb trees,so it'd be safe from any predator,and it can fly!Velociraptor couldn't climb and was flightless.

[Gwangi]

I'd choose an entirely black coloration because dromaeosaurs were most nocturnal.Velociraptor too.So a black coloration would make sense.

Actually very few nocturnal animals are pure black. Most of them are dull, light colours, like the barn owl, which is white and light brown.

This is correct, and I said the same thing in my own post but it looks like I forgot to submit it...or I submitted it to the wrong thread! Anyway, if the rules of fishing apply to this situation than black is a poor choice for night camo. I might work in a dark dense jungle it is seldom pitch black outside and the dark silhouette of a hunting predator against the night sky actually makes it stand out even more. Going back to fishing, you actually use black lures at night because they stand out better to the fish.