interspecies adoption among dinosaurs?

[SBell]

I would personally like to see the reverse based on the videos above--a Triceratops (or Protoceratops) coming across a nest of T.rex (or Velociraptor, or some other appropriate, vulnerable predator) and taking the opportunity as they would.

Actually I've had that idea in my head for a while, with an ironic twist on the famed fighting fossil, velociraptor defending its nest from an aggressive and/or careless protoceratops.

How about a large heard of ceratopsians going full-Cape Buffalo on a small flock of tyrannosaurids?

It has just occurred to me that we are all still disneyfied in our depictions; plant-eaters are at best defenders if not outright chatty and friendly; meat-eaters a clever but generally mean. Anyone who has been around mama cows, bison, moose or even roosters (or worse, geese, the worst dinosaur alive ) knows that trophic level does not determine aggression, meanness, cleverness or friendliness.

[Kayakasaurus]

How about a large heard of ceratopsians going full-Cape Buffalo on a small flock of tyrannosaurids?

Woo-hoo stampede! Ceratopsians seem well equipped to defend themselves. It seems theropods would have quite a challenge taking one down without hunting in packs. They seem built to stand and fight rather then run and expose their backside. Yet in dioramas they are so often the victim. I would like to see more herbivores teaching the carnivores a lesson LOL

[Tyto_Theropod]

I completely agree. We see plenty of depictions T. rex ripping into a nice Trike lunch. I'd like to see one where a Triceratops gores an attacking Tyrannosaur - hell, it needn't even attack. If it was a Mummy Tirceratops and the tyrant got to close for comfort, I'd imagine he'd be in big trouble. And considering that there are now theories coming forward that Ceratopsians might not have been 100% herbivorous, you could even have the Triceratops herd tucking into a nice Tyrannosaurus meal afterwards...

[SBell]

How about a large heard of ceratopsians going full-Cape Buffalo on a small flock of tyrannosaurids?

Woo-hoo stampede! Ceratopsians seem well equipped to defend themselves. It seems theropods would have quite a challenge taking one down without hunting in packs. They seem built to stand and fight rather then run and expose their backside. Yet in dioramas they are so often the victim. I would like to see more herbivores teaching the carnivores a lesson LOL

Oh, Cape buffalo don't attack to protect themselves (always). They're just kind of big and mean and well-armoured and will chase away lions or human hunters or whatever, even if no immediate threat is actually posed. I could easily see a herd of Triceratops quite merrily charging into an otherwise resting group of tyrannosaurs that were ignoring them.

[Kayakasaurus]

I looked up Cape Buffalo and found this video: http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/wild/caught-in-the-act/videos/rhino-vs-cape-buffalo/ .

The thing that stood out to me was how strong that rhino's neck must be to raise that buffalo of the ground. Reminds me of Ceratopsians with their large head and nose horn.

[Shadowknight1]

How about a large heard of ceratopsians going full-Cape Buffalo on a small flock of tyrannosaurids?

Woo-hoo stampede! Ceratopsians seem well equipped to defend themselves. It seems theropods would have quite a challenge taking one down without hunting in packs. They seem built to stand and fight rather then run and expose their backside. Yet in dioramas they are so often the victim. I would like to see more herbivores teaching the carnivores a lesson LOL

Oh, Cape buffalo don't attack to protect themselves (always). They're just kind of big and mean and well-armoured and will chase away lions or human hunters or whatever, even if no immediate threat is actually posed. I could easily see a herd of Triceratops quite merrily charging into an otherwise resting group of tyrannosaurs that were ignoring them.

It's off topic, but seeing that sentence reminded me of this one time I was watching some of my dinosaurs in Jurassic Park: Operation Genesis in Site B mode.  I was watching a T. rex who was just minding his own business and laid down to take a nap cause he was tired.  Then a Triceratops just rushed over and gored it with its horns.  I was astounded!  The rex hadn't even roared in their direction, it just laid down in the grass, and this jerk Trike came over and started a fight.  Poor rex actually ran away! 

[paleoferroequine]

How about a large heard of ceratopsians going full-Cape Buffalo on a small flock of tyrannosaurids?

Woo-hoo stampede! Ceratopsians seem well equipped to defend themselves. It seems theropods would have quite a challenge taking one down without hunting in packs. They seem built to stand and fight rather then run and expose their backside. Yet in dioramas they are so often the victim. I would like to see more herbivores teaching the carnivores a lesson LOL

Here you go, an oldie.

[Kayakasaurus]

Here you go, an oldie.

nice! that puts it in perspective, they really look like they can handle themselves. sure a theropod could do some serious damage but they would have to get past the head first . Snapping turtles are known for their bite force but can you imagine the power of a beak that big?!

[amargasaurus cazaui]

Perhaps somewhat close to topic, or not, but I wonder watching my cat...she will catch things, wether a fly or a little bug and contain it and study it , almost like a pet.........do animals ever show evidence for pet keeping or is this entirely a human type interaction? Not sure if its  a dumb question, but I honestly feel at times watching her, she is keeping pets of things she catches .
   Carrying that over to the topic, might a dinosaur perhaps do something similar if it is possible at all .......or no?

[sauroid]

i once had an oscar who didnt eat one of its goldfish meal and let it grow up into adulthood (just that one particular feeder). they would swim  together like "owner and pet". i had to eventually transfer the ten inch goldfish to a pond.

[paleoferroequine]

i once had an oscar who didnt eat one of its goldfish meal and let it grow up into adulthood (just that one particular feeder). they would swim  together like "owner and pet". i had to eventually transfer the ten inch goldfish to a pond.

   I visited a house where the owner raised piranha. He bred Jack Dempsey cichlids for food for the piranha. Well, in the 50 gallon tank that he had them in was a Jack Dempsey that survived and grew. When I saw them the Dempsey had the piranha corralled into a corner of the tank and wouldn't let them leave, if one came out he would charge it and drive it back in to the corner with the other 12 or so. He also cleared all the gravel from that corner and piled it up in front of them. He was a lot bigger than them also, probably from eating all their food! The guy said he was shortly going to transfer the Dempsey to it's own tank but was fascinated with the situation and had wanted to observe. The piranha had shredded fins and missing scales from their own neurotic response and from the Dempsey. No surprise really, piranha aren't that aggressive and Jack Dempseys definitely are.

[Kayakasaurus]

i once had an oscar who didnt eat one of its goldfish meal and let it grow up into adulthood (just that one particular feeder). they would swim  together like "owner and pet". i had to eventually transfer the ten inch goldfish to a pond.

   I visited a house where the owner raised piranha. He bred Jack Dempsey cichlids for food for the piranha. Well, in the 50 gallon tank that he had them in was a Jack Dempsey that survived and grew. When I saw them the Dempsey had the piranha corralled into a corner of the tank and wouldn't let them leave, if one came out he would charge it and drive it back in to the corner with the other 12 or so. He also cleared all the gravel from that corner and piled it up in front of them. He was a lot bigger than them also, probably from eating all their food! The guy said he was shortly going to transfer the Dempsey to it's own tank but was fascinated with the situation and had wanted to observe. The piranha had shredded fins and missing scales from their own neurotic response and from the Dempsey. No surprise really, piranha aren't that aggressive and Jack Dempseys definitely are.

Sounds more like the Mafia than an owner/pet  LOL

[SBell]

i once had an oscar who didnt eat one of its goldfish meal and let it grow up into adulthood (just that one particular feeder). they would swim  together like "owner and pet". i had to eventually transfer the ten inch goldfish to a pond.

   I visited a house where the owner raised piranha. He bred Jack Dempsey cichlids for food for the piranha. Well, in the 50 gallon tank that he had them in was a Jack Dempsey that survived and grew. When I saw them the Dempsey had the piranha corralled into a corner of the tank and wouldn't let them leave, if one came out he would charge it and drive it back in to the corner with the other 12 or so. He also cleared all the gravel from that corner and piled it up in front of them. He was a lot bigger than them also, probably from eating all their food! The guy said he was shortly going to transfer the Dempsey to it's own tank but was fascinated with the situation and had wanted to observe. The piranha had shredded fins and missing scales from their own neurotic response and from the Dempsey. No surprise really, piranha aren't that aggressive and Jack Dempseys definitely are.

Sounds more like the Mafia than an owner/pet  LOL

There's a reason that species is named after a boxer! And, yeah, piranhas are far over-rated as far as aggressive fish go.

[DinoLord]

As a fish keeper I've seen some interesting interspecific interactions myself. For example similar looking yet genetically distantly related species will sometimes school with each other. I think a lot of it has to do with the captive setting - wild animals generally seem to be quite good at distinguishing members of their own species from others. I know with fish introduction of closely related species or populations to a locale that has another slightly different population/species can often lead to hybridization and rapid loss of genetic purity, though this doesn't seem to always be the case with vertebrates.

[EmperorDinobot]

Really cute artwork

[stargatedalek]

And, yeah, piranhas are far over-rated as far as aggressive fish go.

Correct me if I'm wrong here but aren't they directly descended from primarily herbivorous ancestors? Or are the primarily carnivorous and primarily herbivorous* piranhas not as scatter plotted genetically as I had thought and are rather distinct groups? Sorry for going a bit off topic.

*all of them are really omnivores when it comes down to it

I've seen some strange behavior amongst pets too. My comet has recently reached the size where its started to pick on my turtle, so the turtle tries to stir up the plecostamus to use the tiny ball of armor and spines to fight the comet. Plecostamus can hold its own against the turtle, but the poor comet should be getting its own tank soon if I can find the space for it.

[SBell]

And, yeah, piranhas are far over-rated as far as aggressive fish go.

Correct me if I'm wrong here but aren't they directly descended from primarily herbivorous ancestors? Or are the primarily carnivorous and primarily herbivorous* piranhas not as scatter plotted genetically as I had thought and are rather distinct groups? Sorry for going a bit off topic.

*all of them are really omnivores when it comes down to it

I've seen some strange behavior amongst pets too. My comet has recently reached the size where its started to pick on my turtle, so the turtle tries to stir up the plecostamus to use the tiny ball of armor and spines to fight the comet. Plecostamus can hold its own against the turtle, but the poor comet should be getting its own tank soon if I can find the space for it.

Piranhas are a subfamily of characins, and are carnivore-adapted, however, the closely related pacus are mostly herbivorous. Piranhas tend to be scavenger/opportunists, although ones like Wimple piranhas are horrible (they are scale-eating adapted. Eww).

Really, most characins are mostly carnivorous/piscivorous/insectivorous, but opportunistic. My congo tetras, for their size, have really large, pointy teeth and happily eat pretty much anything.

I've had all sorts of combinations of fish. The captive environment does things to their behaviour, and I would not be inclined to draw any conclusions from that alone. Many aquarium fish are schooling or shoaling, and in a fish tank (where people have a terrible habit of buying two or 3 of each fish species, instead of appropriate numbers of one or 2 species) fish that are used to larger groups would rather combine than face the risk (in their minds) of being a small, easily hunted group.

[sauroid]

i also wonder if there was mimickry among certain dinosaurs? say, a lesser species hanging out with the similar but more robust guys to get protection.
(i've read that half grown pacus which are basically vegetarians would school with red belly piranhas, although pacus can reach a meter in length as adult...)

[Gwangi]

i also wonder if there was mimickry among certain dinosaurs? say, a lesser species hanging out with the similar but more robust guys to get protection.
(i've read that half grown pacus which are basically vegetarians would school with red belly piranhas, although pacus can reach a meter in length as adult...)

There is a species of African cichlid that mimics other African cichlids so it can easily approach them and eat their scales. Cannot remember the name of the species but it was featured in the documentary "Jewels of the Rift" which is a great documentary about the cichlids of Lake Tanganyika. Also, the creature you propose was a species in one of the Dougal Dixon speculative zoology books. But again, it was mimicking a prey species so it could get closer. Cannot remember which book it was.

[SBell]

i also wonder if there was mimickry among certain dinosaurs? say, a lesser species hanging out with the similar but more robust guys to get protection.
(i've read that half grown pacus which are basically vegetarians would school with red belly piranhas, although pacus can reach a meter in length as adult...)

There is a species of African cichlid that mimics other African cichlids so it can easily approach them and eat their scales. Cannot remember the name of the species but it was featured in the documentary "Jewels of the Rift" which is a great documentary about the cichlids of Lake Tanganyika. Also, the creature you propose was a species in one of the Dougal Dixon speculative zoology books. But again, it was mimicking a prey species so it could get closer. Cannot remember which book it was.

I must find this documentary.

And it wouldn't surprise me if there was some sort of mimicry of some kind, by something. Could be herbivores trying to look like a predator, carnivores trying to look like their prey, or something.