Spinosaurus vs Spinosaurus

[Kaprosaurus]

Since 2014,the dinosaur community has been divided into two because of the new spinosaurus reconstruction,the quadruped one.So,i posted this thread so we can discuss about the new spinosaurus reconstruction vs the old one.If there is thread already for this,just put this post in that thread. Here's my point of view,let's start with the biped reconstruction.This reconstruction has been the placeholder since it was discovered in 1912 that is,until 2014.This spinosaurus walked on it's hind legs,although this is mostly unlikely not only because of it's size,but also it's weight.It had a sail that most likely added to it's weight (I researched barely here so pardon me) So if it were to walk in it's hind legs,it would probably fallen over easily,so this mostly is unlikely.Plus providing the evidence behind it's aquatic lifestyle,such as the strange holes in front of its snout that is similar to modern day crocodiles that is used for underwater lifestyle.There are also several evidences that it most likely preyed on fishes,such as Onchopristis.This theory is probably debunked now but it can still be proven.The quadruped theory supports the evidence behind it's aquatic lifestyle,but there are also problems.Such as the weight (Again) theropods can't pronate their hands unless you are talking about JP here,so it has to rely on it's knuckles and it's short hind limbs.But if you add the weight,the hands will probably break in just a second,and remember that the reconstruction is a chimera,which can lead to various inaccuracies.The quadruped theory is much more likely,but it has some flaws.I am part of the semi-bipedal club because the spinosaurus being a quadruped and a biped at the same time sounds good.Looks like we have to wait until we discover a complete skeleton of spinosaurus.Or it's sail is actually a wing and we never noticed the fact that the spinosaurus is actually a dragon                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              

[ImADinosaurRARR]

Or it's sail is actually a wing and we never noticed the fact that the spinosaurus is actually a dragon

Flying Spinosaurus. Boy that would be terrifying 0.0

I am very much in the semi camp until further info is published. After the response to Mark Witton the authors made, I am confidant that the scaling with the legs is correct and that they did their job right, though the conclusion of how it used it's hands still leaves me a bit sceptical. I feel that more fossils from the hand are still needed to conclude how it walked. I have seen scientists comment that, with how the head's resting position was held rather high, that would have shifted it's wait back to the knees allowing it to walk bipedally , though the image is just as strange as the quad walking one ;P

A bit unrelated but this video explains the evolving image of spinosaurus. If you haven't, check this guy out. He's really good: 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-Scag-SUNg

[Kaprosaurus]

I agree with you on that hand bit.But the fact that the spinosaurus' other relatives were bipedal theropods while spinosaurus is quadrupedal just kinda gives it away.I really want to like the new reconstruction,but i find it really weird.Just a question,what reconstruction you like more,the new quadruped one or the old reconstruction

[Nanuqsaurus]

I am now convinced Spinosaurus was an actual dragon and could fly by flapping its sail around real fast.

[Kaprosaurus]

Lol.But what if the spinosaurus is actually a dragon? Seems scientifically impossible considered it's size,but hey,if they say anything is possible,then it's possible!

[Papi-Anon]

I think Spino could run on its hind legs if need be but lightly knuckle-walked for balance without leaning too much on its arms, keeping most of the weight at the hips. Unless I'm forgetting something about its anatomy.

[Kaprosaurus]

That's exactly what i thought! I just can't put it into words.

[stargatedalek]

I think it was probably a "biped", but it would have needed to rest on its underside between steps, the legs just aren't strong enough to hold its weight. The problems it faces are not balance but muscle atrophy, no counterbalance or tail leaning will ever fix that.

[Kaprosaurus]

Wow,I didn't even know there are things such as muscle atrophy! (I know very little about paleontology compared to you guys.) Also,who is that in your profile picture?

[stargatedalek]

Wow,I didn't even know there are things such as muscle atrophy! (I know very little about paleontology compared to you guys.) Also,who is that in your profile picture?

It's not brought up very often because even Ibrahim et al (the ones who published the new Spinosaurus remains) glossed over it. This is a pretty good write up on it.
http://antediluviansalad.blogspot.ca/search?q=spinosaurus

Kongou from Kancolle.

[HD-man]

Hope this helps: http://novataxa.blogspot.com/2016/01/spinosaurine-cenomanian-morocco.html

[Neosodon]

I think the bipedal quadrupedal debate is is kind of silly. What if it could not walk on land at all and just slid up on land to lay it's eggs and stuff. If the small legged reconstructions are correct then I think neither quadrupedal or bipedal would be likely. To solve the hand problem it could have crawled around on it's elbows.

I think a debate on how large or powerful it's limbs were would be more useful. Right now the skeletal reconstructions seem to be all over the place making this a difficult topic to discuss.

[Kaprosaurus]

I don't know if this is plausible but i have seen somewhere that spinosaurus' limbs are actually more useful in water than in ground because it's limbs are actually lighter so it wasn't strong enough.I forgot the source so if it's wrong,well,i am not going there again.I think the crawling spinosaurus isn't right.Why? Considering the ecosystem that the spinosaurus lived in,it's very unlikely,how could they intimidate other predators? Or defend their territory against other animals of it's time,although it's probably good on water.Sorry if it sounded like a rant right there,remember i know very little about paleontology compared to you guys.

[stargatedalek]

I don't know if this is plausible but i have seen somewhere that spinosaurus' limbs are actually more useful in water than in ground because it's limbs are actually lighter so it wasn't strong enough.I forgot the source so if it's wrong,well,i am not going there again.I think the crawling spinosaurus isn't right.Why? Considering the ecosystem that the spinosaurus lived in,it's very unlikely,how could they intimidate other predators? Or defend their territory against other animals of it's time,although it's probably good on water.Sorry if it sounded like a rant right there,remember i know very little about paleontology compared to you guys.

There really isn't much reason for Spinosaurus to defend its territory. It was eating fish and even the large crocodilians of the time weren't large to eat some of the truly monstrous fish they lived with.

[Kaprosaurus]

Ooh,okay.Thanks so much for the information! I'm learning so much from all of you,it seems like joining here is actually good!

[Neosodon]

I don't know if this is plausible but i have seen somewhere that spinosaurus' limbs are actually more useful in water than in ground because it's limbs are actually lighter so it wasn't strong enough.I forgot the source so if it's wrong,well,i am not going there again.I think the crawling spinosaurus isn't right.Why? Considering the ecosystem that the spinosaurus lived in,it's very unlikely,how could they intimidate other predators? Or defend their territory against other animals of it's time,although it's probably good on water.Sorry if it sounded like a rant right there,remember i know very little about paleontology compared to you guys.

Since Spionosaurus was aquatic it would not be trying to fight off other predators on land. Their territory was in the water. The only thing that would try to take a Spinosaurus's territory would be another Spinosaurus. There may have been mosasaurs and crocodiles but they would encounter each other in the water.

The only reason I can think of that would drive a Spinosaurus across land would be to get to another waterway. If it encountered a hungry Cacarodontosaurs on the way it was probably screwed.

Kaprosaurus, don't be intimidated to tell your view point even if you think you know very little. Getting things wrong is the quickest way to learn in my opinion.

[Kaprosaurus]

Thanks,it's probably because this is my first time talking to people on the internet directly