Spinosaurus new look!

[Simon]

In the meantime, here is Scott Hartman's post explaining why "Sue" the TRex weighed more than the type Giganotosaurus specimen:

http://www.skeletaldrawing.com/home/mass-estimates-north-vs-south-redux772013

[Simon]

While we wait for Scott Hartman's Spino weight estimate, here is a comparison of Sue the TRex, Giganotosaurus and "Super Spinosaurus" profiles....

...here is a hint as to what you should look for in this picture:  look at the torso of the TRex.  Not only is it much taller than, but remember that it is also wider sideways than the other two animals.... (caveat:  I am excluding the Spino's sail from the definition of 'torso' because if you look at that sail you will miss what I am trying to point out ... sure the sail adds weight, but not that much because it is so thin)

TRex was a true "heavyweight fighter".  Spinosaurus will outweigh it due to sheer size, but - my prediction as we await Scott's input - NOT BY THAT MUCH....

[stargatedalek]

tyrannosaurus had a lot of "flesh mass", but its bones are hollow, spinosaurus has solid bones, and bones are the majority of an animals weight

[amanda]

Keeping in mind that Spinosaurus looked nothing like that of course.....

[amargasaurus cazaui]

I keep reading in here about Spinosaurus and how it was "supposed to walk around when on land"....has anyone possibly considered that it did not do that? We are dealing with a completly different dinosaur than one previously known......what if the rest of the skull were found and this dinosaur also sported a nice well formed set of gills for instance? Or supposed it did lead a completely aquatic lifestyle........not sure that it had to walk on land

[stargatedalek]

^not sure if kidding or if gills are suddenly considered reasonable amount of spec

in all seriousness though, I don't see why it would have any significant trouble moving on land with tiny legs, its not exactly chasing after prey or running away from predators

[amargasaurus cazaui]

^not sure if kidding or if gills are suddenly considered reasonable amount of spec

in all seriousness though, I don't see why it would have any significant trouble moving on land with tiny legs, its not exactly chasing after prey or running away from predators

I think any speculation about this dinosaur is reasonable. The original specimen was excavated in one country, stored in crates for several years and then sent to Stromer, who never saw the actual material in the ground or how any of it was associated, and did not himself find nor remove it. While erecting his specimen, he found evidence that there was a second species he called Spinosaurus B present in the material. Adding to this enormous mess, he also named and identified at least a handful of crocodilians from the same material, most of which have since proven unlikely as well.
  Stromer was a Junker, born of German aristocracy and was titled and owned land. As a result of the first world war he was reduced to a penniless state. His precious crates of fossils from which he would find spinosaurus were stuck in Egypt and a friend as a gift had to pay the expense of shipping them. Stromer needed something to come from these finds, to help him financially and perhaps allow him to secure a better position or funding.
  Later during world war 2 he lost either one or both of his sons , killed while in action fighting for Germany, and his beloved dinosaurs were destroyed by the RAF in a nightime bombing mission.
  It bears noting that there has been little material found from this dinosaur since, except isolated bits. Now we have this new material gleaned from questionable sources, and not clearly even identified as being from the same dinosaur or species.......the facts regarding its recovery and study are not particularly compelling of themselves.
    Given all of this background, the entire species may well be dubious, a chimera of other animals as many have suggested, or not being properly understood. Given the reality behind it, this dinosaur may well not be even closely related to dinosaurs being used to infer its appearance.....Baronyx, Irritator, etc.

[Simon]

amargasaurus cazaui:

I agree with what you've posted, although personally I think (as I believe you do) that "its not as bad as all that".....in any event, this is some of the most exciting on-going dinosaur news of my lifetime so I am enjoying the debate and hoping - given how developments on these critters usually move at a glacial pace - that the "Spinosaurnado" swirling around this find will force the actors to show their cards a little more quickly - we know there is other Spinosaur material out there, whether as yet undescribed officially or in private hands, and I hope this will "smoke out" some of that other material and add more pieces to this wonderful Spinosaurus puzzle we are all excited about ...

[Simon]

Fascinating post from last year where Scott Hartman talks about the pitfalls of estimating mass/weight of larger specimens based on smaller specimens (and discusses the Irritator/Spinosaurus skull similarities and differences):

http://www.skeletaldrawing.com/home/scaling-issues-a-minor-irritation712013

[Raptoress]

This'll probably sound really silly, but is it possible that if Spinosaurus really did walk on all fours, that it would hold its largest claw up a bit like a Velociraptor would?

[Balaur]

This'll probably sound really silly, but is it possible that if Spinosaurus really did walk on all fours, that it would hold its largest claw up a bit like a Velociraptor would?

No. It can't pronate its hands.

[suspsy]

I wonder which company will be the first to release a quadrupedal, dip-finned, narrow-bodied, web footed Spinosaurus? Collecta, probably.

[amanda]

CollectA  for sure. Safari won't as their most recent is just too new to redo. Safari won't. Doug has already explained that they are shying from too speculative. Battat surely won't for similar reasons. I can see Schleich of bullyland doing it. But really that is not saying too much

[suspsy]

CollectA  for sure. Safari won't as their most recent is just too new to redo. Safari won't. Doug has already explained that they are shying from too speculative. Battat surely won't for similar reasons. I can see Schleich of bullyland doing it. But really that is not saying too much

Yeah, that was my reasoning. Out of all the dino companies, Collecta's the most willing to take speculative risks. Also, their current 1:40 Spinosaurus isn't all that great, so they've got even more reason to design a new one.

[Concavenator]

CollectA  for sure. Safari won't as their most recent is just too new to redo. Safari won't. Doug has already explained that they are shying from too speculative. Battat surely won't for similar reasons. I can see Schleich of bullyland doing it. But really that is not saying too much

Yeah, that was my reasoning. Out of all the dino companies, Collecta's the most willing to take speculative risks. Also, their current 1:40 Spinosaurus isn't all that great, so they've got even more reason to design a new one.

Their current 1:40 Spinosaurus is really bad.A new one IS needed.

[Dinomike]

I'n no specialist on the topic but I got rather excited about seeing this new Spinosaurus!  Spinosaurus has never been my favorite dinosaur but it has certainly become one now! What an amazing creature it is! I have been following this thread for a while and I also bought a copy of the National Geographic October 2014 issue with its wonderful illustrations by Davide Bonadonna. After I saw people speculating which toy company would be the first to produce a revised Spinosaurus, well, I got excited I decided to make my own based on Nizar Ibrahim and his team's reconstructions. This creature here is in 1:50 scale and the colors have been heavily influenced by Bonadonna. I will later build a stand of some sort to have the Spinosaurus actually swim in water. (Now it kinda looks like a boat on dry land.) I will be sharing more stuff on this Spinosaurus project of mine under my diorama thread as soon as I get started on the base. (Oh, and CollectA, I'll be happy to sculpt one Spino for you too! Haha! )

[Yutyrannus]

Very cool!

[tyrantqueen]

Looks good. Although forum member Brandon was one of the first to sculpt a "neo-spino", and even before that, one could purchase a 3D print on Shapeways of Galileo's work. I honestly thought CollectA would bring out a Spinosaurus this year.

[spinosaurus1]

There is supposedly more Spinosaurus info to come from other groups, including a study that is going to seperate Spinosaurus into two distinct species.

Seth Sorensen of Fossilshack remarked on that coming down the pipeline from people he knows, and he also completely disagreed with their proportions, saying he had Spinosaurus leg bones, that if scaling by the studies proportions, would make the animal that his came from twice as big as their proposed model. He said they will be donating their material to some universities soon.

not saying that their reconstruction is wrong, just saying that it isn't definite and more material is apparently coming soon. if this is a justifiable addition to spinosaurus osteology, spinosaurus may go through another reconstruction.

more to come

[DinoToyForum]

@Dinomike, looks great!