PNSO: New for 2022

[SRF]

@CARN0TAURUS I wouldn't count on PNSO releasing a new Wilson sculpt (or a new T. Rex in general) very soon. They've just remarketed Wilson with all the extras that also come with the Triceratops, Iguanadon and that Spinosaurus rerelease.

Since the first Wilson had two repaints, I'm wondering if we're going to see a repaint of Winter Wilson first before a new sculpt will arrive.

Like Antey I also hope that before then, PNSO releases more Tyrannosaurids. I'm especially eagerly waiting for an Albertosaurus from them and I would like to see their take om Daspletosaurus as well. A Nanuqsaurus would also be very interesting.

[Faras]

All that is known about this tyrannosaurid is a piece of the lower jaw, very little to single out a separate genus! The figurine, as always with PNSO, is great, but I'm disappointed. I really wanted tyrannosaurids from the Campanian age - Daspletosaurus, Gorgosaurus and Albertosaurus. In this case, I will pass. The dream of the Daspletosaurus PNSO fades into the distance.

@Antey There are quite some undescribed tyrannosarids fossils in Zhucheng Dinosaur Museum (pics from tieba: http://tieba.baidu.com/p/7242930126)

Edit: also plenty of discovered yet still burried stuffs.

[Faelrin]

Well after I woke up and saw this, my first thought was that I hope this one pleases you @suspsy as you've wanted this one for ages it seems. It should pair well with their Sinoceratops too.

@Antey Yes I really want to see PNSO take on all of those. The recent ceratopsians and hadrosaurids could use some of those great predators on the shelves alongside them too.

Also still no Acrocanthosaurus yet obviously, but still hope it comes. Gonna keep holding off the Papo one just a bit longer.

[CARN0TAURUS]

@CARN0TAURUS I wouldn't count on PNSO releasing a new Wilson sculpt (or a new T. Rex in general) very soon. They've just remarketed Wilson with all the extras that also come with the Triceratops, Iguanadon and that Spinosaurus rerelease.

Since the first Wilson had two repaints, I'm wondering if we're going to see a repaint of Winter Wilson first before a new sculpt will arrive.

Like Antey I also hope that before then, PNSO releases more Tyrannosaurids. I'm especially eagerly waiting for an Albertosaurus from them and I would like to see their take om Daspletosaurus as well. A Nanuqsaurus would also be very interesting.

@SRF
Perhaps I failed to articulate what I meant to say properly.  I want to buy this and think of Zhuchengtyrannus as my Wilson 3.0, slightly smaller but also at a lower price.  It's a compromise but @ 20-33% less cost. That's why I asked if there are any glaring anatomical reasons that this new Zhuchengtyrannus can't stand in as a T-rex at a slightly smaller scale?  It has the robust looking skull of a typical T-rex and it has the integument that I would've wanted in Wilson, he even comes in a similar paint scheme!   He's just a bit smaller than Wilson, right? 

[Mellow Stego]

Oh this one's nice. But I think I'm gonna wait for Rebor's before choosing my next tyrannosaur.

[Flaffy]

All that is known about this tyrannosaurid is a piece of the lower jaw, very little to single out a separate genus! The figurine, as always with PNSO, is great, but I'm disappointed. I really wanted tyrannosaurids from the Campanian age - Daspletosaurus, Gorgosaurus and Albertosaurus. In this case, I will pass. The dream of the Daspletosaurus PNSO fades into the distance.

@Antey There are quite some undescribed tyrannosarids fossils in Zhucheng Dinosaur Museum (pics from tieba: http://tieba.baidu.com/p/7242930126)

Edit: also plenty of discovered yet still burried stuffs.

^^^ I remember reading about these unpublished specimens too. IIRC there are also some undescribed Sinoceratops in the region as well.
I wouldn't be surprised if PNSO has knowledge of these particular specimens and used them in their reconstruction.

[CarnotaurusKing]

@CARN0TAURUS I wouldn't count on PNSO releasing a new Wilson sculpt (or a new T. Rex in general) very soon. They've just remarketed Wilson with all the extras that also come with the Triceratops, Iguanadon and that Spinosaurus rerelease.

Since the first Wilson had two repaints, I'm wondering if we're going to see a repaint of Winter Wilson first before a new sculpt will arrive.

Like Antey I also hope that before then, PNSO releases more Tyrannosaurids. I'm especially eagerly waiting for an Albertosaurus from them and I would like to see their take om Daspletosaurus as well. A Nanuqsaurus would also be very interesting.

@SRF
Perhaps I failed to articulate what I meant to say properly.  I want to buy this and think of Zhuchengtyrannus as my Wilson 3.0, slightly smaller but also at a lower price.  It's a compromise but @ 20-33% less cost. That's why I asked if there are any glaring anatomical reasons that this new Zhuchengtyrannus can't stand in as a T-rex at a slightly smaller scale?  It has the robust looking skull of a typical T-rex and it has the integument that I would've wanted in Wilson, he even comes in a similar paint scheme!   He's just a bit smaller than Wilson, right? 

The legs might be a bit too long, and the torso a bit too short (in lateral view) and thin (in dorsal view) to be a proper stand-in for Tyrannosaurus. Though even Wilson's chest is a bit thinner than a Tyrannosaurus's chest perhaps should be, so you may not be that far off anyway. I'm not sure though, so don't take my word for it.

[Sim]

All that is known about this tyrannosaurid is a piece of the lower jaw, very little to single out a separate genus! The figurine, as always with PNSO, is great, but I'm disappointed. I really wanted tyrannosaurids from the Campanian age - Daspletosaurus, Gorgosaurus and Albertosaurus. In this case, I will pass. The dream of the Daspletosaurus PNSO fades into the distance.

@ Antey, at the rate they are releasing these, I can't imagine them not making Daspletosaurus, Gorgosaurus and Albertosaurus.  Look how many theropods they made last year.  And they've already announced an Acrocanthosaurus this year.  I wouldn't be surprised if another 1-2 of the ones you mentioned are already in the planning stages or even further along.

I too am disappointed PNSO is making a Zhuchengtyrannus.  And I also would like them to make Daspletosaurus (horneri or the Dinosaur Park species), Gorgosaurus and Albertosaurus, as well as Acrocanthosaurus.  I hope you're right about the upcoming figures @CARN0TAURUS, I still hope they will be made and I think you should still have hope @Antey!

[SRF]

@CARN0TAURUS I wouldn't count on PNSO releasing a new Wilson sculpt (or a new T. Rex in general) very soon. They've just remarketed Wilson with all the extras that also come with the Triceratops, Iguanadon and that Spinosaurus rerelease.

Since the first Wilson had two repaints, I'm wondering if we're going to see a repaint of Winter Wilson first before a new sculpt will arrive.

Like Antey I also hope that before then, PNSO releases more Tyrannosaurids. I'm especially eagerly waiting for an Albertosaurus from them and I would like to see their take om Daspletosaurus as well. A Nanuqsaurus would also be very interesting.

@SRF
Perhaps I failed to articulate what I meant to say properly.  I want to buy this and think of Zhuchengtyrannus as my Wilson 3.0, slightly smaller but also at a lower price.  It's a compromise but @ 20-33% less cost. That's why I asked if there are any glaring anatomical reasons that this new Zhuchengtyrannus can't stand in as a T-rex at a slightly smaller scale?  It has the robust looking skull of a typical T-rex and it has the integument that I would've wanted in Wilson, he even comes in a similar paint scheme!   He's just a bit smaller than Wilson, right? 

The legs might be a bit too long, and the torso a bit too short (in lateral view) and thin (in dorsal view) to be a proper stand-in for Tyrannosaurus. Though even Wilson's chest is a bit thinner than a Tyrannosaurus's chest perhaps should be, so you may not be that far off anyway. I'm not sure though, so don't take my word for it.

The proportions seem to be a bit different from T. Rex indeed. On the other hand, we don't really know what Zhuchengtyrannus proportions are anyway.

To determine the scale of this figure, I think it's best to measure the size of the head. For now we can't tell how this Zhuchengtyrannus head measures up compared to Wilson and the Tarbosaurus. Looking at this Zhuchengtyrannus from the top, the head is very much shaped like a T. Rex. I doubt that Zhuchengtyrannus would actually have a skull widened at the back like T. Rex did, while Tarbosaurus didn't have that skull shape.

Also because the tail is bended, the true length of the figure will probably be around 30 cm in stead of the advertised 28.5 cm. But to determine if this figure could work as a 1:40 scale T. Rex, more measurements are needed.

In my collection this would just be a Zhuchengtyrannus. I do like this one even more than the Tarbosaurus though. Looking forward to put those two next to each other on my shelf.

[Antey]

Correction: Zhuchengtyrannus is known from most of the lower jaw and a section of the upper jaw. The specimen is diagnostic, the genus is valid, and we know enough about big tyrannosaurids to have a very good idea of how it looked in life.

Typical speculation. What can a piece of the lower jaw say about the length of the tail and the shape of the growths on the skull? I am silent about intraspecific variability. It's just that insufficiently responsible scientists like to think of themselves as a discoverer.

[Antey]

All that is known about this tyrannosaurid is a piece of the lower jaw, very little to single out a separate genus! The figurine, as always with PNSO, is great, but I'm disappointed. I really wanted tyrannosaurids from the Campanian age - Daspletosaurus, Gorgosaurus and Albertosaurus. In this case, I will pass. The dream of the Daspletosaurus PNSO fades into the distance.

@Antey There are quite some undescribed tyrannosarids fossils in Zhucheng Dinosaur Museum (pics from tieba: http://tieba.baidu.com/p/7242930126)

Edit: also plenty of discovered yet still burried stuffs.

What are these individual bones worth? Yes, they are probably tyrannosaurid bones. But there are no articulated skeletons in any way complete. Therefore, Juchengtiran is a nomen dubium. At best, this is an individual of the Tarbosaurus.

[CARN0TAURUS]

@CARN0TAURUS I wouldn't count on PNSO releasing a new Wilson sculpt (or a new T. Rex in general) very soon. They've just remarketed Wilson with all the extras that also come with the Triceratops, Iguanadon and that Spinosaurus rerelease.

Since the first Wilson had two repaints, I'm wondering if we're going to see a repaint of Winter Wilson first before a new sculpt will arrive.

Like Antey I also hope that before then, PNSO releases more Tyrannosaurids. I'm especially eagerly waiting for an Albertosaurus from them and I would like to see their take om Daspletosaurus as well. A Nanuqsaurus would also be very interesting.

@SRF
Perhaps I failed to articulate what I meant to say properly.  I want to buy this and think of Zhuchengtyrannus as my Wilson 3.0, slightly smaller but also at a lower price.  It's a compromise but @ 20-33% less cost. That's why I asked if there are any glaring anatomical reasons that this new Zhuchengtyrannus can't stand in as a T-rex at a slightly smaller scale?  It has the robust looking skull of a typical T-rex and it has the integument that I would've wanted in Wilson, he even comes in a similar paint scheme!   He's just a bit smaller than Wilson, right? 

The legs might be a bit too long, and the torso a bit too short (in lateral view) and thin (in dorsal view) to be a proper stand-in for Tyrannosaurus. Though even Wilson's chest is a bit thinner than a Tyrannosaurus's chest perhaps should be, so you may not be that far off anyway. I'm not sure though, so don't take my word for it.

When I see this I just think T-rex, why are we giving this animal a separate name?  The difference in the models could easily be chalked up to the differences between two individuals of the same exact species.  Not counting the skin on Wilson which is obviously over scale.

[stargatedalek]

What are these individual bones worth? Yes, they are probably tyrannosaurid bones. But there are no articulated skeletons in any way complete. Therefore, Juchengtiran is a nomen dubium. At best, this is an individual of the Tarbosaurus.

Well in that case, Tyrannosaurus and Tarbosaurus are nomen dubium too. They're known from more specimens, including far more complete ones, but none of them (barring some in private hands or awaiting description that can't be authenticated) were preserved fully articulated.

[Antey]

What are these individual bones worth? Yes, they are probably tyrannosaurid bones. But there are no articulated skeletons in any way complete. Therefore, Juchengtiran is a nomen dubium. At best, this is an individual of the Tarbosaurus.

Well in that case, Tyrannosaurus and Tarbosaurus are nomen dubium too. They're known from more specimens, including far more complete ones, but none of them (barring some in private hands or awaiting description that can't be authenticated) were preserved fully articulated.

You do not understand the meaning of the term nomen dubium. Both Tarbosaurus and Tyrannosaurus rex have enough articulated skeletons to distinguish separate genera. Zhuchentiran is described separately from a piece of the jaw. To understand the difference, compare the holotype of Tarbosaurus and the holotype of Juchentyran.

[suspsy]

Correction: Zhuchengtyrannus is known from most of the lower jaw and a section of the upper jaw. The specimen is diagnostic, the genus is valid, and we know enough about big tyrannosaurids to have a very good idea of how it looked in life.

Typical speculation. What can a piece of the lower jaw say about the length of the tail and the shape of the growths on the skull? I am silent about intraspecific variability. It's just that insufficiently responsible scientists like to think of themselves as a discoverer.

"Typical speculation"? What is that supposed to mean anyway? And why would it be necessary to know the length of the tail in order for Zhuchengtyrannus  to be considered a valid taxon? And are you really trying to accuse David Hone and his Chinese colleagues of being irresponsible?

You do not understand the meaning of the term nomen dubium. Both Tarbosaurus and Tyrannosaurus rex have enough articulated skeletons to distinguish separate genera. Zhuchentiran is described separately from a piece of the jaw. To understand the difference, compare the holotype of Tarbosaurus and the holotype of Juchentyran.

@stargatedalek knows exactly what a nomen dubium is and Zhuchengtyrannus is most assuredly not an example of one. New species are described from single diagnostic pieces of bone all the time; a complete skeleton is obviously ideal, but by no means essential for the process.

Can you cite any paleontologists who agree with your argument? I've certainly never heard Brusatte or Holtz or Carr or any other tyrannosaurid specialist even suggest such a thing. Where are you getting this notion from?

[stargatedalek]

What are these individual bones worth? Yes, they are probably tyrannosaurid bones. But there are no articulated skeletons in any way complete. Therefore, Juchengtiran is a nomen dubium. At best, this is an individual of the Tarbosaurus.

Well in that case, Tyrannosaurus and Tarbosaurus are nomen dubium too. They're known from more specimens, including far more complete ones, but none of them (barring some in private hands or awaiting description that can't be authenticated) were preserved fully articulated.

You do not understand the meaning of the term nomen dubium. Both Tarbosaurus and Tyrannosaurus rex have enough articulated skeletons to distinguish separate genera. Zhuchentiran is described separately from a piece of the jaw. To understand the difference, compare the holotype of Tarbosaurus and the holotype of Juchentyran.

You do not understand the meaning. Tyrannosaurus and Tarbosaurus are known from a lot of bones, but no preserved articulated skeletons, which is what you claim formed the basis of Zuchengtyrannus being a nomen dubium.

[CARN0TAURUS]

I'm calling it Wilson 2.5, LOL.  It looks fantastic, I can't wait to get one, and PNSO will keep making $ from the likes of me as long as they keep making theropods like this.  Theropods are my favorite types of dinosaurs and as difficult as it's been to not buy Wilson or Domingo because of scale issues, buying this is an easy choice.  I mean just look at that beautiful figure! 

[bmathison1972]

nomen dubium has nothing to do with the abundance of specimens or the condition the specimen is in. You can have a valid name based on just a tooth (if it has unique features to distinguish it). Nomen dubium is used when there is uncertainty between the original decryption and the specimen, or when the type specimen is presumed lost and cannot be compared to the original description and/or the description is too vague to match to a specimen.

Can you cite any paleontologists who agree with your argument? I've certainly never heard Brusatte or Holtz or Carr or any other tyrannosaurid specialist even suggest such a thing. Where are you getting this notion from?

II don't agree with Antey nor stargatdalek, entirely, and I am not a paleontologist, but I am probably one of the few people on this forum that has described new species of animals ;-)

[JohannesB]

Irresponsible is a word that only applies to actions that would hurt or jeopardize an existing living being or life in general, I think Any paleontologist would not feel offended if she was called 'irresponsible' (unless her actions would possibly destroy precious evidence or materials). Being called negligent or dumb, yes, that would make her feel offended, possibly. Irresponsible, no, because anyone else could easily rectify her mistake and as such put the matter straight and everything is just right with the world again. Anyway, an interesting discussion. But again, I think I will pass on this figure, even though I think it shows the epitome of excellence that PNSO is reaching with their latest figures. In my humble opinion, anyway. I must say though, that I find the pose a bit precarious (for reasons of stability of the figure), or maybe even a bit awkward (even though it is quite realistic, I think.)

[Antey]

I don't know what those present at the forum are doing, but I wrote my first scientific article in 1990. And my supervisor taught me responsibility. Read the works of Feyerabend on the principles of the functioning of science in order to get rid of the reverence for the word "scientist". Science is full of crooks and irresponsible people who dream of fame and grants. A piece of the lower jaw cannot be the basis for isolating the genus. Megalosaurus has been a phantom for 200 years.