Ingenia`s sculpts: now digital (and a question)

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Todd Marshall is one of my favorite artists, hence the spikey-look many of my dinos sport.  It's really looking nice so far..very fierce !

The Citipati looks VERY nice..I'm determined to get some of this epoxy and give it a go eventually.   I also wish I could make taxidermy-style eyes for my pieces.

BTW, you have to sell me something eventually.. lol

Blade, have you ever visited the avesstudio.com website? There you can find the Apoxie Sculpt which I use, although as a european I don`t buy it from this site directly.The shop I am buying is a german one who sells normally to people who are sculpting and collecting model horses. (I think it is strange that someone would make a model horse when you could instead make a dinosaur! )
The eyes can be found in special taxidermist shops, the price for a pair is between 10-20 € depending on the size, so I guess you can find some in the U.S: as well.

I haven't. But will certainly do so now !

Could be cool to do some twisted carousel horses for Halloween.. heh heh  but still not cooler than a Dino !

You know I've never been into a taxidermy shop. I should find one or look around more online for some.

[mmfrankford]

Van Dykes is a great north american site for taxidermy eyes and supplies. The prices are affordable, shipping is fast, and big selection of sizes and colors.

http://www.vandykestaxidermy.com/Eyes-C2.aspx

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Van Dykes is a great north american site for taxidermy eyes and supplies. The prices are affordable, shipping is fast, and big selection of sizes and colors.

http://www.vandykestaxidermy.com/Eyes-C2.aspx

Thanks Melissa !

[ingenia]

I am trying to finish  the left hand/underarm and work  on the basic form for the right hand as well.


I added some spikes at the underarm (did I mention I like  spikes?! ), so it finally starts to get a shape.



Basic form for the other hand.Added claws and a simple coat of epoxy.The middle finger will be sculpted seperately and connected when the other fingers are sculpted.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Love adding spines on the arms ! Looks very natural to me.

[Balaur]

I am trying to finish  the left hand/underarm and work  on the basic form for the right hand as well.


I added some spikes at the underarm (did I mention I like  spikes?! ), so it finally starts to get a shape.



Basic form for the other hand.Added claws and a simple coat of epoxy.The middle finger will be sculpted seperately and connected when the other fingers are sculpted.

Wow! Very brilliant job! This Rugops is going to be freaking epic!!!! Aaaaaawwww!!!!! 

[ingenia]

Wow! Very brilliant job! This Rugops is going to be freaking epic!!!! Aaaaaawwww!!!!! 

Thank you, I really hope it turns out the way I planned it, but it is a very long way to go.

Love adding spines on the arms ! Looks very natural to me.

I wasn`t sure about adding spikes at first, but I think it looks good now.The Todd Marshall drawing seems to have them too, although the resolution of the pictures I have is not good enough to clearly say this.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Wow! Very brilliant job! This Rugops is going to be freaking epic!!!! Aaaaaawwww!!!!! 

Thank you, I really hope it turns out the way I planned it, but it is a very long way to go.

Love adding spines on the arms ! Looks very natural to me.

I wasn`t sure about adding spikes at first, but I think it looks good now.The Todd Marshall drawing seems to have them too, although the resolution of the pictures I have is not good enough to clearly say this.

I'd say your right given Marshall's art style. I wish he had some larger images files to reference.

[TheAllosaur]

These are downright awesome. I wish i could draw as well as you do these.
I love Acrocanthosaurus! One of my definite favorites. Cant wait to see the finished one.

[ingenia]

Some small update.I worked on the styrofoam tail and wanted to see how the parts fit , to see the dimensions, so I taped them together.Total length is about 2,20m (86 inch).







I have to say I am happy how it looks so far, but it is a lot of work, and I really don`t know when the whole thing will be finished.

[Yutyrannus]

Some small update.I worked on the styrofoam tail and wanted to see how the parts fit , to see the dimensions, so I taped them together.Total length is about 2,20m (86 inch).



I have to say I am happy how it looks so far, but it is a lot of work, and I really don`t know when the whole thing will be finished.

Ahhhhhhhhhh! Pronated hands!

[ingenia]

i was a bit unsure about the hand movement. Would you say it is impossible(but It would be difficult to change)?

[ZoPteryx]

i was a bit unsure about the hand movement. Would you say it is impossible(but It would be difficult to change)?

I really hate to say it, because this piece is absolutely gorgeous, but that type of hand position was probably not possible.  A bigger issue though, but one (based on your photos) you may still have a chance to correct, is the arms.  Rugops' arms were severely reduced, with no functional elbow.  Here's a skeletal:

[ingenia]

i was a bit unsure about the hand movement. Would you say it is impossible(but It would be difficult to change)?

I really hate to say it, because this piece is absolutely gorgeous, but that type of hand position was probably not possible.  A bigger issue though, but one (based on your photos) you may still have a chance to correct, is the arms.  Rugops' arms were severely reduced, with no functional elbow.  Here's a skeletal:

I know these reconstruction, but as no bone material of rugops arms were found (and as it lived much earlier than carnotaurus) there is a chance the arms were not reduced like later abelisaurs.It is just a possibility, but I base the sculpture mainly on Todd Marshalls Art, where it has relative strong arms, and I mentioned earlier that I chose it because it looks more satisfying for display.
With the hands I have to admit I  mostly overlooked these pronated or not discussions, I always thought the hand would be that flexible, so I will really try to change it.
Thanks for your help!

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

Wow..I'm always impressed looking at your posts..it just keeps getting better !

I have to agree on the hand position sad to say..I hate having to make changes when something is so far along and going well.  Marshall's style is excellent but he hasn't updated a lot of his work in awhile .  The arm length is fine until they find any fossils to indicate otherwise. I always like to think to think of Appalachisaurus as having tyrannosaur arms ala Marshall's depiction, but some are restoring it now with more allosaur-like arms but both can be right I think.

[wings]

i was a bit unsure about the hand movement. Would you say it is impossible(but It would be difficult to change)?

I really hate to say it, because this piece is absolutely gorgeous, but that type of hand position was probably not possible.  A bigger issue though, but one (based on your photos) you may still have a chance to correct, is the arms.  Rugops' arms were severely reduced, with no functional elbow.  Here's a skeletal:

I wonder how much of materials do we have of Rugops? I always thought we just have a partial head (as mentioned here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rugops). If all we have is just its head it would be hard to tell whether it's elbows are immobile. We have animals like the Eoabelisaurus (http://www.dinoastur.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/PolRauhut2012_fig1.jpg, http://www.dinoastur.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Eoabelisaurus-esqueleto.jpg and http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/suppl/2012/05/17/rspb.2012.0660.DC1/rspb20120660supp1.pdf for more detailed photos) which appears to be able to flex their elbows (looks about 90 degrees). Eoabelisaurus is also an early abelisaurs and its closely related Rugops (as seen on Pol and Rauhut 2012 study but you can see a simpler version on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abelisauridae), Eoabelisaurus do have "fairly" reduced forelimbs though (http://www.earthtimes.org/newsimage/dinosaurs-ruled-pampas_323512.jpg the middle figure) but just aren't as severe as the one shown on Todd's Rugops diagram. It's very unlikely that they have the ability to rotate their hands (see picture of the articulated lower arm bones photos/diagram from the above links, almost interlocking ulna and radius), since Eoabelisaurus is more primitive than Rugops and less advance than say aucasaurus, and none of these animals (Eoabelisaurus and aucasaurus) can rotate their hands. So all we know for now seems to be that Rugops can "probably" flex their elbows but unlikely to rotate its lower arms.

[ingenia]

First I have to say thanks to you all for the feedback. I thought about it for a day and came to the decision to sculpt the arms completely new, as the actual ones can`t be fixed completely.So the new version will have Carnotaurus-like  reduced arms and non-pronated hands. I didn`t have a problem with the fact I sculpted them larger as in most reconstructions, the fact that no arm bones were found and it is a more primitive Abelisaur left at least the possibility, but the position of the hands is 100% sure incorrect, and it is not my intention to make an unrealistic sculpture (I just overstyle some things a bit).
It was  a mistake I could have easily avoided with better research, but I am not frustrated about the extra work, it is just sad that I think the result looked really good.
Criticism is always good and helps to make things better, I just was a bit shocked  from yutyrannus comment yesterday(just because I didnt think there was something scientifically wrong, but thanks yutyrannus, although you made me sweat )

I have to say my dinosaur interest started and lasted in a time where there was no internet, I got all my knowledge from books and figures at that time, and things like hand movement wasn`t a theme to be discussed very often at that time. I then lost my interest for several years and started to get back into this whole `dinosaur thing` about 3 or 4 years ago, mainly because I liked paleoart a lot.So with the internet there are a lot more options to gain knowledge, and I have  a lot to catch up.
Just  to avoid mistakes in the future: can someone give me an overview which dinosaur groups did have pronated hands and which didn`t ?

[amargasaurus cazaui]

I see a potential positive to the learning in this for one thought. For the other I would suggest to remove the arms, finish them seperately and keep them as a seperate display. They are stunning pieces on their own and would like nice mounted to a placque or flat alone. Why destroy good artwork ...that is almost done, just save it and present it in a seperate context.

[Yutyrannus]

Sorry. I actually meant it as a joke .

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

First I have to say thanks to you all for the feedback. I thought about it for a day and came to the decision to sculpt the arms completely new, as the actual ones can`t be fixed completely.So the new version will have Carnotaurus-like  reduced arms and non-pronated hands. I didn`t have a problem with the fact I sculpted them larger as in most reconstructions, the fact that no arm bones were found and it is a more primitive Abelisaur left at least the possibility, but the position of the hands is 100% sure incorrect, and it is not my intention to make an unrealistic sculpture (I just overstyle some things a bit).
It was  a mistake I could have easily avoided with better research, but I am not frustrated about the extra work, it is just sad that I think the result looked really good.
Criticism is always good and helps to make things better, I just was a bit shocked  from yutyrannus comment yesterday(just because I didnt think there was something scientifically wrong, but thanks yutyrannus, although you made me sweat )

I have to say my dinosaur interest started and lasted in a time where there was no internet, I got all my knowledge from books and figures at that time, and things like hand movement wasn`t a theme to be discussed very often at that time. I then lost my interest for several years and started to get back into this whole `dinosaur thing` about 3 or 4 years ago, mainly because I liked paleoart a lot.So with the internet there are a lot more options to gain knowledge, and I have  a lot to catch up.
Just  to avoid mistakes in the future: can someone give me an overview which dinosaur groups did have pronated hands and which didn`t ?

It's great you can move on and learn from it. I know many who can't unfortunately. Heck it's by being on this forum that I learned about the new hand positions myself.

I think all dinosaurs had the hands in the " clapping " not " slapping " position. At least all theropods. Still not 100% on hadrosaurs and such though. The design of their hands makes them a little more difficult from what I can tell.