Takamas Question Thread

[Takama]

For the Animasaurus Collection.

I will feather it like the Tarbosaurus i posted.

For my One of a Kind line, (the Golden Eye Collection)   I will Go Full Featherd

[Takama]

Ok   I decided i want to base the Tarbosaurus for the Animasaurus Collection on this pose.




Photos By Yasuyuki Tsukuda

But James I Kirkland says that this pose is unlikely.   Exactly whats wrong with it?   I know the tail needs to be straight.

[stargatedalek]

Well it's gut would probably have to actually touch the ground to balance, but other than that I don't see any problems with the pose.

[Takama]

Ok now for somthing a little Controversal

I was thinking of doing Sexual Dimophisim with some models

Now My plan is to do Three Troodonts. Two Female and one Male.

The male will be elaborately feathered, with a Tail fan, while the Two Females will be like the Blue Carnegie Oviraptor(only it will have wings)

Heres the Kicker. The Too Females are not interested in the Showy male, in fact there interested in each-other.  Yes, Homosexuality like some birds do today in the wild(there was evean All your Yesterdays entry toying with this idea)  The females are posed simalr to the Sideshow Dilophosaurus Pair and there are Duller colored to show that there well female


Now My Questions are Rather or not that this would be a Plausible thing for Female Dinosaurs to do?  Everytime i hear about homosexuality in birds, its always with males, but what about females?

Plus I was thinking of making one Sex Larger then the other, so which one should be bigger?  The Male?  or the Two Females?

[stargatedalek]

I think it's very plausible and sounds like an interesting idea. As for which is larger I can't really say, that depends on the behavior you want to base them off of.

One bit of advice, Troodon have unevenly placed ears, so a facial disc to accentuate that hearing is key. Not necessarily to the extent of an owl, something like a frogmouth might be more conservative.

[Raptoress]

This is based off of me, isn't it? I love it. XD

[Halichoeres]

Female birds are adventurous, too, for example western gulls (Wingfield et al. 1982 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0003347282802315). In strongly dimorphic species of bird, the males tend to be larger, but there are exceptions. In spotted sandpipers and phalaropes, females are both larger and more showy. Most predatory birds have similar plumage, but the females average larger. I think the safest thing to do is make the showier sex a little larger, whichever it happens to be.

[HD-man]

Now My Questions are Rather or not that this would be a Plausible thing for Female Dinosaurs to do?  Everytime i hear about homosexuality in birds, its always with males, but what about females?

http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20150206-are-there-any-homosexual-animals

Plus I was thinking of making one Sex Larger then the other, so which one should be bigger?  The Male?  or the Two Females?

Predatory theropods in general probably had "reverse dimorphism" ( http://www.jplegacy.org/board/showpost.php?p=1073970&postcount=1505 ). As indicated in Barden's paper, that seems to include troodonts. AFAIK, though, none of the relevant sources say how size dimorphic troodonts were, so I'd guesstimate that they were more like coelophysoids than tyrannosaurs ("Paul (1988) estimated the weight of the gracile form at 15 kg (33 lb), and the weight of the robust form at 20 kg (44 lb).[7]": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coelophysis#Description ) given the Chapman et al. quote. If you ever do something similar for eudromaeosaurs, I'd guesstimate that they were more like tyrannosaurs than coelophysoids (See the highlighted paragraphs: https://books.google.com/books?id=xb14otTPn5UC&pg=PA249&dq=%22three+hours%22+%22female+dominance%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjBzPf-z9LJAhUFKB4KHdE9A40Q6AEIHTAA#v=onepage&q=%22three%20hours%22%20%22female%20dominance%22&f=false ). Hope this helps.

Quoting Chapman et al. ( http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/fae/DBWpdf/Rpr5_1997aChapmanetal.pdf ):

The reversed sexual dimorphism model is considered reason- able because it follows the patterns seen in birds of prey, where dimorphism tends to be reversed and the differences larger as the prey gets larger and more active (see Amadon. 1975). The prey for T. rex presumably would be very large and active and, consequently, the large difference in size (in this case robust- ness) between the two morphs would be reasonable.

[Takama]

Ok the Next Theropod i want to do is Arosteon. Problem is, this comes from a family that leaves me stuck with ambiguity

Thomas Holtz told me that this family is either a family of Allosars or Colurosaurs.  My question is which one should i go for

If its the former, i will have Jetoar Sculpt it in Scales, but if its the latter, i will have him Feather it.   Anyone's thoughts?

[DinoLord]

Seems like most cladograms have it close to Megaraptor, a coelurosaur.

[HD-man]

Ok the Next Theropod i want to do is Arosteon. Problem is, this comes from a family that leaves me stuck with ambiguity

Thomas Holtz told me that this family is either a family of Allosars or Colurosaurs.  My question is which one should i go for

If its the former, i will have Jetoar Sculpt it in Scales, but if its the latter, i will have him Feather it.   Anyone's thoughts?

Based on what Holtz said ("Are megaraptorans really carnosaurs? In the book I point out that they are hard to place: maybe they are megalosauroids ("spinosauroids" at the time), maybe they are carnosaurs, maybe they are primitive coelurosaurs? A new possibility was suggested by Fernando Novas and his colleagues: that they are actually tyrannosauroids! I do see some similarities there, but am not yet convinced that the evidence fits this hypothesis better than the megaraptorans-as-neovenatorid-carcharodontosaurs hypothesis. We'll see what new discoveries are made": https://www.geol.umd.edu/~tholtz/dinoappendix/ ), I'd say allosaurs.

Seems like most cladograms have it close to Megaraptor, a coelurosaur.

Megaraptor, yes. Coelurosaur, not necessarily.

[Takama]

I debated about giving the model a Featherd back like the Rebor Yutyrannus.   This will give ways to intepreta the model.


If its an Allosaur, then It would com off as pure Speculation, but if its a Colurosaur, then it will be and Inaccurate Underfeatherd Specimen. anyone Agree?

[HD-man]

I debated about giving the model a Featherd back like the Rebor Yutyrannus.   This will give ways to intepreta the model.


If its an Allosaur, then It would com off as pure Speculation, but if its a Colurosaur, then it will be and Inaccurate Underfeatherd Specimen. anyone Agree?

I'd stick w/the completely scaly allosaur interpretation.

[Sim]

Speaking as someone who isn't an expert, I've found the classification of megaraptorans as allosauroids has felt forced and not really convincing.  People have seemed so sure megaraptorans are allosauroids while all megaraptoran fossils were known from very fragmentary remains which included almost no fossil material from the skull.

I'm open to the possibility megaraptorans are allosauroids.  Currently though, it seems more likely they are coelurosaurs to me.  What has been found of that juvenile Megaraptor skull really doesn't look like an allosauroid skull to me.  It seems like it would be much more likely to arise from a coelurosaur than an allosauroid.

I imagine that deciding whether to reconstruct a megaraptoran as an allosauroid or coelurosaur could also affect the way the head looks?

[stargatedalek]

I'd go with a light covering of feathers. This will ensure that you are covered if they are coelurosaurs and won't be outrageously speculative if they aren't.

[Takama]

I'd go with a light covering of feathers. This will ensure that you are covered if they are coelurosaurs and won't be outrageously speculative if they aren't.

Exactly my line of Thinking

[LophoLeeVT]

well the sort of thing people did for the bullyland liliensternus

[Sim]

Based on what Holtz said ("Are megaraptorans really carnosaurs? In the book I point out that they are hard to place: maybe they are megalosauroids ("spinosauroids" at the time), maybe they are carnosaurs, maybe they are primitive coelurosaurs? A new possibility was suggested by Fernando Novas and his colleagues: that they are actually tyrannosauroids! I do see some similarities there, but am not yet convinced that the evidence fits this hypothesis better than the megaraptorans-as-neovenatorid-carcharodontosaurs hypothesis. We'll see what new discoveries are made": https://www.geol.umd.edu/~tholtz/dinoappendix/ ), I'd say allosaurs.

That Thomas Holtz quote is from 2013.  Directly below this is said:

NEW January 2015: The discovery of a juvenile Megaraptora specimen does show they had long slender snouts, similar to some primitive tyrannosauroids.

And, it links to this page: http://www.krank.ie/category/sci/nat/megaraptor-tyrannosaur/



Currently, there's disagreement over whether megaraptorans are allosauroids or coelurosaurs.  As allosauroids, the unequivocal allosauroid Neovenator has been suggested to form the family Neovenatoridae with the megaraptorans.  As coelurosaurs, megaraptorans have been suggested to be tyrannosauroids, with the unequivocal tyrannosauroid Eotyrannus being a megaraptoran.

Fortunately, both upper and lower jaws of Neovenator and Eotyrannus are known, the lower jaw of the megaraptoran Australovenator is known, and thanks to a recent discovery the upper jaw of a juvenile Megaraptor is known, allowing them to be compared!

Once again, here's the link with the juvenile Megaraptor skull material: http://www.krank.ie/category/sci/nat/megaraptor-tyrannosaur/
Australovenator: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Australovenator_wintonensis.png
Eotyrannus: http://scotthartman.deviantart.com/art/Britain-s-got-tyrannosauroids-376083184
Neovenator: http://scotthartman.deviantart.com/art/A-new-hunter-hope-365505774

The jaw of Megaraptor and Australovenator to me look a lot more like elongated versions of the jaws of Eotyrannus (and the other tyrannosauroid Dilong) and completely different to the jaws of Neovenator.  The teeth of Megaraptor and Australovenator also seem to look more like those of tyrannosauroids than those of allosauroids.

[HD-man]

Based on what Holtz said ("Are megaraptorans really carnosaurs? In the book I point out that they are hard to place: maybe they are megalosauroids ("spinosauroids" at the time), maybe they are carnosaurs, maybe they are primitive coelurosaurs? A new possibility was suggested by Fernando Novas and his colleagues: that they are actually tyrannosauroids! I do see some similarities there, but am not yet convinced that the evidence fits this hypothesis better than the megaraptorans-as-neovenatorid-carcharodontosaurs hypothesis. We'll see what new discoveries are made": https://www.geol.umd.edu/~tholtz/dinoappendix/ ), I'd say allosaurs.

That Thomas Holtz quote is from 2013.  Directly below this is said:

NEW January 2015: The discovery of a juvenile Megaraptora specimen does show they had long slender snouts, similar to some primitive tyrannosauroids.

And, it links to this page: http://www.krank.ie/category/sci/nat/megaraptor-tyrannosaur/

As you can see, Holtz already mentioned the tyrannosauroid hypothesis in the 1st quote & didn't say whether the new evidence was any more convincing than the old evidence. In other words, there was no point in including both quotes.

The jaw of Megaraptor and Australovenator to me look a lot more like elongated versions of the jaws of Eotyrannus (and the other tyrannosauroid Dilong) and completely different to the jaws of Neovenator.  The teeth of Megaraptor and Australovenator also seem to look more like those of tyrannosauroids than those of allosauroids.

Maybe it's only a superficial resemblance, maybe it isn't. That's why I'm waiting for new papers to either confirm or refute said hypothesis b-4 taking a side. I only suggested the "completely scaly allosaur interpretation" for the purposes of Takama's toy.

[stargatedalek]

This is another topic but there is no sound evidence against the presence of feathers on Allosaurs, speculative yes, but no direct evidence against it. Just something to keep in mind when deciding on integument.