David Silva's Beasts of the Cenozoic and Eons mammoth Backerkit Sept 3rd

[andrewsaurus rex]

I agree.  Anyone who shies away from Cenozoic fauna because they think it is of no interest, is doing themselves a disservice, imo.   Not only a fascinating array of animals, but it's interesting to see how life started over in a wholly new direction after the mass extinction.

[Faelrin]

@Lynx No not specifically just you. It's just a sentiment I've picked up from some folks response to this being announced.

Am I understanding correctly that your main concern is mostly coloration, if not sculpt? I think in cases like the Woolly mammoth, woolly rhino, cave lion, and Megaloceros, where we have an idea of what their colorations where in life, I don't think it would be good to stray or deviate from those too much. Honestly, I think it is actually quite amazing we have some to work from at all after all this time (much like some dinosaurs like Microraptor, and Psittacosaurus, etc). If I recall correctly there's even some ground sloth fur out there.

But it's free game for everything else. There is still quite a bit of variation that could be used as inspiration, for both carnivores and herbivores, mammals, or others.

Unless you meant BotM, then I don't think there's a concern for potential diversity in a line like BotC. Just see my massive wishlist (and no doubt I've still missed some I'd like to have) for a small sample of what's out there. There's a plethora of creatures spanning from post K-Pg until now, and far from just mammals. Some truly strange and wondrous. Some of the largest or unique non-dinosaur reptiles also lived in the Cenozoic as well. Obviously you have Titanoboa, but also things like Barinasuchus, Carbonemys, Meiolania, Purussaurus, Quinkana, Stupendemys, and the "Megalania", and many more. So even if mammals might still be too bland, or tame, there's still lots of untapped potential that could be used for those.

Also it just occurred to me, that many of these animals are far smaller then most of the dinosaurs in the line. I imagine those will be much cheaper as a result of that. Most expensive would easily be any large proboscideans and of course Paraceratherium, depending on if any of those get made.

[Eatmycar]

@Lynx

I want to say I echo your sentiments a hundred percent on this line. I got into Beasts of the Mesozoic because I love articulated dinosaurs. I previously was collecting Mattel, Papo, and PNSO and Dave's work blew me away when I saw it. No gimmicks, no frills, just fully articulated and adult targeted dinosaurs in standard 1/18.

Dave Silva got me into this hobby with dinosaurs and his willingness to try bold color schemes, and the massive 1/18 scale, not 1/35 like most companies. His desire to constantly eschew Fan's Choice Jurassic Park suggestions also kept me invested as I've grown exhausted of that dead franchise's mostly stale designs and color palette requests.

It's a little disheartening to see this line expand from a deep well into a giant pool of completely unrelated content, and completely eschewing well known, basic Hadrosaurs, Ornithomimids, and even things like Ankylosaurus to focus on mundane creatures. Already, people are requesting bizarre genera that most people don't know about for this Cenozoic line and it just seems so disappointing that what will overtake dinosaur essentials that will sell well are obscure genera of deer and big cats.

My only interest with Cenozoic at this point is either with early hominids and great apes such as Australopithecus or Gigantopithecus... or avians. Rocs, Dodos, Terror Birds, etc. There are no decent, never mind good, figures of our ancestors or Gigantopithecus out there, and if a Dodo or a Roc is the only way to get a dinosaur out of this line, I'll happily pick it up.

Otherwise I'm voting with my wallet on this line, sadly. It seems like the Mattel Hammond Collection will be filling out a lot of my shelf space because Beasts Of The Mesozoic is focusing on fluff(y) animals.

[GojiraGuy1954]

@Lynx

I want to say I echo your sentiments a hundred percent on this line. I got into Beasts of the Mesozoic because I love articulated dinosaurs. I previously was collecting Mattel, Papo, and PNSO and Dave's work blew me away when I saw it. No gimmicks, no frills, just fully articulated and adult targeted dinosaurs in standard 1/18.

Dave Silva got me into this hobby with dinosaurs and his willingness to try bold color schemes, and the massive 1/18 scale, not 1/35 like most companies. His desire to constantly eschew Fan's Choice Jurassic Park suggestions also kept me invested as I've grown exhausted of that dead franchise's mostly stale designs and color palette requests.

It's a little disheartening to see this line expand from a deep well into a giant pool of completely unrelated content, and completely eschewing well known, basic Hadrosaurs, Ornithomimids, and even things like Ankylosaurus to focus on mundane creatures. Already, people are requesting bizarre genera that most people don't know about for this Cenozoic line and it just seems so disappointing that what will overtake dinosaur essentials that will sell well are obscure genera of deer and big cats.

My only interest with Cenozoic at this point is either with early hominids and great apes such as Australopithecus or Gigantopithecus... or avians. Rocs, Dodos, Terror Birds, etc. There are no decent, never mind good, figures of our ancestors or Gigantopithecus out there, and if a Dodo or a Roc is the only way to get a dinosaur out of this line, I'll happily pick it up.

Otherwise I'm voting with my wallet on this line, sadly. It seems like the Mattel Hammond Collection will be filling out a lot of my shelf space because Beasts Of The Mesozoic is focusing on fluff(y) animals.

Sounds kinda like cope to me ngl

[Carnoking]

Much as I too would have preferred a Hadrosaur line (criminally under appreciated dinosaurs), or really any dinosaur or Paleozoic related stuff, I can't be mad about Cenezoic getting a chance in the spotlight after 3 successful dinosaur centric lines and one Dino related line that will be giving us a variety of species from different groups currently under development. That alone makes for well over 60 species and counting produced or in development (13 raptors, 25 ceratopsians, 18 Tyrannosaurs, and 14 shortlisted Cyberzoic dinosaurs plus all their repaints, fan choice color schemes, different scaled versions, nestlings, and accessory pack dinos).
At this point, saying we haven't gotten enough dinos out of David would be like Marvel fans complaining they haven't gotten enough comic book movies out of Disney.
It probably helps that I'll be saving a lot of money given that I'm not looking to collect the Cenezoic animals, but I'm sure it will make a lot of people who have taken the back seat these past several years very happy. Plus, I'm still very interested to see what all David has up his sleeve even if it's not for me.

[Lynx]

I don't have concerns that BOTC is going to overshadow BOTM or whatever, I'm just worried BOTC will have less diversity, that's it.

I recommend looking into cenozoic fauna. There is absolutely a large diversity of animals. If anything, I'd say David will be able to have a much greater variety of different species with this cenzoic line than BOTM.

I don't know much regarding the Cenozoic, but I will try, thank you!

[Lynx]

@Lynx No not specifically just you. It's just a sentiment I've picked up from some folks response to this being announced.

Am I understanding correctly that your main concern is mostly coloration, if not sculpt? I think in cases like the Woolly mammoth, woolly rhino, cave lion, and Megaloceros, where we have an idea of what their colorations where in life, I don't think it would be good to stray or deviate from those too much. Honestly, I think it is actually quite amazing we have some to work from at all after all this time (much like some dinosaurs like Microraptor, and Psittacosaurus, etc). If I recall correctly there's even some ground sloth fur out there.

I mean some animals that we do not know the colors of, often are given the same exact color scheme by every single brand. Small patterning will be nice, but I understand if trying to go for a more realistic approach regarding how speculative they're making these mammals.

I am also curious if they will give the Smilodon exposed fangs? I don't mind if they do, but I recall a theory that it may have been covered by lips or flaps of skin.

[Flaffy]

I don't have concerns that BOTC is going to overshadow BOTM or whatever, I'm just worried BOTC will have less diversity, that's it.

I recommend looking into cenozoic fauna. There is absolutely a large diversity of animals. If anything, I'd say David will be able to have a much greater variety of different species with this cenzoic line than BOTM.

I feel like the only reason why the Cenozoic is perceived as having a lack of diversity is because of the sheer lack of attention given to anything other than the Ice Age. (Along with a couple stragglers from Pleistocene South America)

Plenty of weirdos from the Eocene, Oligocene and Miocene just itching to be made into figures.

[Lynx]

Also would like to mention by 'diversity' I mean how different color schemes are going to be from one another.

[suspsy]

It's a little disheartening to see this line expand from a deep well into a giant pool of completely unrelated content, and completely eschewing well known, basic Hadrosaurs, Ornithomimids, and even things like Ankylosaurus to focus on mundane creatures. Already, people are requesting bizarre genera that most people don't know about for this Cenozoic line and it just seems so disappointing that what will overtake dinosaur essentials that will sell well are obscure genera of deer and big cats.

I think this is a rather self-defeating argument for the simple reason that many of the genera that appear in the Raptor, Ceratopsian, and Tyrannosaur line are just as obscure as any Cenozoic ones. Everyone on the planet knows T. rex, Velociraptor, and Triceratops, but there are scores of hardcore dinosaur fans who have never heard of Teratophoneus or Balaur or Albertaceratops. How are those ones any different in terms of popularity compared to Arctotherium or Simbakubwa or Megatherium? Personally, I find the latter three more interesting.

As for the notion that BotC will be less successful because you can't colour a mammoth like a collared lizard or a giant sloth like a hyacinth macaw, I again emphasize that the series will simply not need flashy colours in order to be well received. These figures will stand tall and firm regardless by way of their sculpting and their accuracy. And many of carnivorous mammals and reptiles in particular will still allow for plenty of creative leeway in terms of coloration. If anything, BotC represents Creative Beast's biggest challenge yet.

I'm also going to argue that Cenozoic beasts deserve more toys as much as any group of overlooked dinosaurs. Even with the woolly mammoth and Smilodon, the two most iconic prehistoric mammals of all, you have scores of toys that have come out over the years, but very few that can truly be described as top quality. I've reviewed several Smilodon toys for the blog and they all have wonky proportions. I also find most woolly mammoth figures to be substandard. I think Safari versions are still the best overall in spite of their age.

And on a purely pragmatic note, I don't see much point in debating further about whether BotC is "right" or "wrong." The decision has been made, it's been formally announced, and unless Creative Beast Studio suffers some crippling financial setback in the future, God forbid, it's going to become a reality. And if Arctotherium is indeed confirmed to be part of BotC, then I'll pour myself a vodka ginger ale to celebrate the news.

[Lynx]

@Lynx

I want to say I echo your sentiments a hundred percent on this line. I got into Beasts of the Mesozoic because I love articulated dinosaurs. I previously was collecting Mattel, Papo, and PNSO and Dave's work blew me away when I saw it. No gimmicks, no frills, just fully articulated and adult targeted dinosaurs in standard 1/18.

Dave Silva got me into this hobby with dinosaurs and his willingness to try bold color schemes, and the massive 1/18 scale, not 1/35 like most companies. His desire to constantly eschew Fan's Choice Jurassic Park suggestions also kept me invested as I've grown exhausted of that dead franchise's mostly stale designs and color palette requests.

It's a little disheartening to see this line expand from a deep well into a giant pool of completely unrelated content, and completely eschewing well known, basic Hadrosaurs, Ornithomimids, and even things like Ankylosaurus to focus on mundane creatures. Already, people are requesting bizarre genera that most people don't know about for this Cenozoic line and it just seems so disappointing that what will overtake dinosaur essentials that will sell well are obscure genera of deer and big cats.

My only interest with Cenozoic at this point is either with early hominids and great apes such as Australopithecus or Gigantopithecus... or avians. Rocs, Dodos, Terror Birds, etc. There are no decent, never mind good, figures of our ancestors or Gigantopithecus out there, and if a Dodo or a Roc is the only way to get a dinosaur out of this line, I'll happily pick it up.

Otherwise I'm voting with my wallet on this line, sadly. It seems like the Mattel Hammond Collection will be filling out a lot of my shelf space because Beasts Of The Mesozoic is focusing on fluff(y) animals.

I think Cenozoic is completely related and deserves to be made into a line of it. As much as I love dinosaurs, that shouldn't stop others from being able to enjoy new lines of their own.

It's not like BOTM is being abandoned, just another line is being added for a larger audience. It will be a long time before any line comes for the Cenozoic, and Cyberzoic (mind you are perfectly on par with regular BOTM models) will still be a thing, and quite large at that.

Am I uninterested in this line? Yes, I am. Does that mean I think it should not exist or that it's overshadowing BOTM? No. The BOTM line itself is massive and the creator has no plans on stopping it.

[Lynx]

As for the notion that BotC will be less successful because you can't colour a mammoth like a collared lizard or a giant sloth like a hyacinth macaw, I again emphasize that the series will simply not need flashy colours in order to be well received. These figures will stand tall and firm regardless by way of their sculpting and their accuracy. And many of carnivorous mammals and reptiles in particular will still allow for plenty of creative leeway in terms of coloration. If anything, BotC represents Creative Beast's biggest challenge yet.

Again, I am not implying in the slightest they need to be brightly colored, as I have said several times already. I would just like to see something like REBOR did (with their mammals), not wild or extremely out there, but still a little different from what we currently have. It can be different and not be colored like a unicorn.

For the animals we know the colors of, or can make very close assumptions, I do not mind at all, but for those that don't, something the tiniest bit different will be welcomed.

Edit: I also don't recall mentioning I thought the line will not be successful because it isn't 'different'? I just said I would like to see something different. Correct me if I am wrong however, as this thread is a rather long read.

[Lynx]

@Lynx No not specifically just you. It's just a sentiment I've picked up from some folks response to this being announced.

Am I understanding correctly that your main concern is mostly coloration, if not sculpt? I think in cases like the Woolly mammoth, woolly rhino, cave lion, and Megaloceros, where we have an idea of what their colorations where in life, I don't think it would be good to stray or deviate from those too much. Honestly, I think it is actually quite amazing we have some to work from at all after all this time (much like some dinosaurs like Microraptor, and Psittacosaurus, etc). If I recall correctly there's even some ground sloth fur out there.

But it's free game for everything else. There is still quite a bit of variation that could be used as inspiration, for both carnivores and herbivores, mammals, or others.

Yes, that is what I mean. I have no concerns regarding the sculpt, as it is always exceptional from them.

[Bread]

Maybe I am alone with this opinion, but I really don't mind.
What makes a BOTM Smilodon different from every. single. other. brand. if they just give it a pale color or brown? Nothing. Any company can make a well-articulated model, but not every company can match the creative design behind it.

Maybe I am being biased here, but the criticism regarding the coloration seems to be redundant.

"What makes a BOTM Smilodon different from every. single. other. brand. if they just give it pale color or brown?"

Never knew David's line revolves around color schemes.

[Lynx]

Maybe I am alone with this opinion, but I really don't mind.
What makes a BOTM Smilodon different from every. single. other. brand. if they just give it a pale color or brown? Nothing. Any company can make a well-articulated model, but not every company can match the creative design behind it.

Maybe I am being biased here, but the criticism regarding the coloration seems to be redundant.

"What makes a BOTM Smilodon different from every. single. other. brand. if they just give it pale color or brown?"

Never knew David's line revolves around color schemes.

I will blatantly admit you are right in this degree. I do feel I went too far with that comment.

Edit: I think I will be leaving this conversation if it does escalate further, I don't want to argue further with people about something today

[Bread]

Yes, this will not be as brightly colored as the ceratopsian, tyrannosaur, raptor line, but what if we had evidence for Tyrannosaurus to be completely a shade of green or brown? Would this present the same criticism just as these cenozoic mammals are receiving? Or is it just because they are cenozoic mammals and everyone would rather have dinosaurs?


I want to be completely honest with this line because I have yet to share my
opinion of interest.

I won't be collecting this line just like the previous ones. They are too large for my collection (~1/25 to 1/40) plus space issues. However, David likes to provide a 1/35 scale model to collectors like myself.

I mean com'on... Yall aren't happy to possibly have a 1/35 Scale Tyrannosaurus fighting a 1/35 Mammoth displayed? FULLY ARTICULATED!!!

@Lynx no worries. Again, I advise checking out prehistoric mammals/Cenozoic era animals. I don't collect such figures often but they are interesting. Not so bland as you think.

[Lynx]

Yes, this will not be as brightly colored as the ceratopsian, tyrannosaur, raptor line, but what if we had evidence for Tyrannosaurus to be completely a shade of green or brown? Would this present the same criticism just as these cenozoic mammals are receiving? Or is it just because they are cenozoic mammals and everyone would rather have dinosaurs?


I want to be completely honest with this line because I have yet to share my
opinion of interest.

I won't be collecting this line just like the previous ones. They are too large for my collection (~1/25 to 1/40) plus space issues. However, David likes to provide a 1/35 scale model to collectors like myself.

I mean com'on... Yall aren't happy to possibly have a 1/35 Scale Tyrannosaurus fighting a 1/35 Mammoth displayed? FULLY ARTICULATED!!!

@Lynx no worries. Again, I advise checking out prehistoric mammals/Cenozoic era animals. I don't collect such figures often but they are interesting. Not so bland as you think.

This does make me a bit more excited   

[andrewsaurus rex]

with mammals, it will be striking patterns, rather than striking colours..   And if you think that sounds dull, well i would beg to differ.  Look at the giant anteater, cheetah, zebra,  tiger......perhaps they seem dull because they are so common and well known but for the patterns they wear to evolve on them the way they have is remarkable.   And there are scores of other examples of remarkable and interesting patterns evolving.   I am look forward to a line that doesn't have gaudy colours.  Many of my ceratopsians  I've repainted because i felt the colours were ridiculous....totally unrealistic and unlikely.  The tyrannosaur series, thankfully, looks better in that regard.

I've very keen on BOTC.....don't be mammal chauvinists, you guys.....lol.

[Pliosaurking]

I would have personally preferred a paleozoic line or a either a marine reptile or crocodylomorph line, but there are things I'm excited for. I personally don't have a huge interest in Cenozoic stuff for the most part but I'll be keeping an eye on this line for sure.

[Halichoeres]

I think it's premature to think that BotC will supplant or draw resources away from BotM. As others have suggested, I think it's first and foremost a place to park the Cenozoic animals that are already planned for Cyberzoic. I expect Cyberzoic to eventually add some Paleozoic animals as well, and at that time I imagine we'll see the debut of BotP. I can just about guarantee that Mesozoic stuff will dominate releases pretty much forever, with Cenozoic stuff being sprinkled in here and there. I'm sure there'll be hadrosaurs (the most frequently made group that people manage to convince themselves is infrequently made) and all the other stock dinosaurs by and by.