David Silvas New Kickstarter: Articulated Dinosaur TOYS

[Sim]

I asked to have my Beasts of the Mesozoic order cancelled, and David has now done this.  If anyone would like to know why this has been done, this is the comment I left on the most recent Kickstarter update:

Taya Castillo and dlipkowitz have said David has already paid to have the first wave (accessory packs, nestlings, build-a-raptors) sent out. This is not entirely true. This was done for those in the US only. It wasn't done for those with international orders. It was originally going to be done for international orders too "to get product out to backers as soon as possible" "at no additional cost". In a Kickstarter update almost two months later, David said international orders would no longer be split to avoid international customers having to pay customs fees twice.

I spent some time checking, and it appeared if my order was split so the accessory packs shipped before the deluxe raptors, as was originally going to be done for international orders, both parts of the order would not have a value that would cause a customs fee charge. I sent David a message explaining this and asked if it would be possible to have my order split as originally planned and as was done for those in the US. David told me in order to do that, I would need to make another payment for shipping.

Those in the US didn't have to make an additional payment to have accessory packs/nestlings/build-a-raptors shipped ahead of the deluxe raptors, and this would've been true for those with international orders too before David said he wouldn't split international orders to avoid backers having to pay a customs fee twice. So unlike what David has said, the reason my order hasn't been split isn't so I don't pay customs twice, it's because I would've needed to pay for additional shipping to have it split. I feel deceived, and it's a very unpleasant feeling.

It's doesn't feel very nice or fair to see those in the US receive the accessory packs/nestlings/build-a-raptors, while I (and anyone else who would like their international order split) have to wait around two more months to receive the same figures, unless a payment for additional shipping is made which was not originally needed and that those receiving these figures in the US didn't have to pay. What makes it worse is that David has done nothing to make me (or other international backers) feel better about this. He's actually made me feel worse, by making it appear like my order wasn't being split so I don't pay customs duty twice, and then telling me I need to make a previously unneeded payment if I'd like it split. I'm taken aback by how David has dealt with shipping the accessory packs/nestlings/build-a-raptors before the deluxe raptors.

I've been patient and supportive throughout this Kickstarter such as with regards to delays, telling others about Beasts of the Mesozoic and how it's good, and sharing information that could be helpful for the figures. In principle, I would be willing to wait for my order to ship when it's all ready, that's what I paid for. However, after seeing the preferential treatment those in the US received with having the first wave sent free of additional charge, this not being done for international backers even if the only given reason of avoiding paying a customs fee twice wouldn't happen, initially saying international orders would be split at no additional cost but when this is requested a payment being requested, and the general attitude around all this, I feel I can no longer take this.

At this point, I'm a little sad to say my interest in Beasts of the Mesozoic is almost all gone. After considering it, I'd like to ask if I could have my order cancelled and be refunded. The alternative is waiting for figures I now have almost no interest in and which remind me of the unpleasant experience I've described in this comment, needing to be available to collect them when they arrive in perhaps a month, and having to pay a customs fee when they arrive. Funnily enough, if my order was split so the accessory packs shipped before the deluxe raptors, I wouldn't have to pay any customs fees, but if it isn't split I do have to pay a customs fee due to its value. So, splitting it as was originally going to be done for international orders and was done for those in the US would've been nice for me due to not causing any customs fee as well as allowing me to receive the non-delayed figures. The reason for splitting these orders in the first place was to do something nice for backers, wasn't it? It looks like in the end it was only those in the US that warrant this nice thing.

I noticed David has replied to my comment, in which he says, "since you'd prefer to continue our discussion here", but his reply comes after refunding my order at which point I am no longer considered a backer, so I can't post/reply on the Beasts of the Mesozoic Kickstarter anymore.  In David's reply, I feel there is more misleading comments and more of the lack of openness that made me decide to stop being involved with Beasts of the Mesozoic.  There are a few things I'd like to comment on.  According to David he only had an idea of the cost of shipping the first wave (accessory packs, etc.) after he said he would ship them once they were available for all orders free of charge.  At this point in the Kickstarter I find that very surprising, I seem to remember him saying earlier how he had learnt not to under-predict costs through this Kickstarter.

David said:

If given the opportunity, I would have shared this information with you in our message conversation and perhaps we could have worked out an agreeable arrangement, but you did not give me that opportunity.

This is false, the opportunity was there in the private messages we exchanged.  Also, how David has presented our private message exchange previously in his reply is a misrepresentation.  There was also a second opportunity for us to work out an agreeable arrangement after I left my last comment on Kickstarter.  David chose to refund my order without trying to discuss and reach an alternative arrangement first, and then after I became unable to comment on the Kickstarter as a result, he posts that reply.


Now that my order has been cancelled, I feel some sadness, but also relief.

[postsaurischian]

....... Funnily enough, if my order was split so the accessory packs shipped before the deluxe raptors, I wouldn't have to pay any customs fees, but if it isn't split I do have to pay a customs fee due to its value. So, splitting it as was originally going to be done for international orders and was done for those in the US would've been nice for me due to not causing any customs fee as well as allowing me to receive the non-delayed figures. The reason for splitting these orders in the first place was to do something nice for backers, wasn't it? It looks like in the end it was only those in the US that warrant this nice thing. .......

As I have mentioned before, I'm also a bit disappointed because of these two reasons. Being among the first backers to get the project started and being the very last to receive anything isn't nice and not in the sense of backing.

To me it's not so bad that I'm losing interest in the project, but I understand what you mean, Sim.

My consequence will be that I won't be backing any future projects anymore. I will be better off placing an order after having waited until everything's done in order to choose the best options.

[stargatedalek]

I feel obliged to add that the shipping charge itself for international orders was already outrageous on top of all of this. It would have cost me roughly $80-$90 in Canada to purchase one raptor and have it shipped through the Kickstarter. Whereas I payed around $60 by pre-ordering through BBTS instead even after their mark-up solely because of the shipping charges.

I highly recommend anyone outside of the US do something similar and order their raptors/ceratopsians through a third party.

[Faelrin]

I received the Wetlands and Forest Environment accessory packs today, that I ordered last Friday. Now I have all of them. These are really awesome diorama sets, even if they are intended to be used alongside the larger raptors that I'm (and I'm sure many of you are) waiting for still. They can surely hold their own. Ditto for the little nestling packs, though I only have the Amber ones currently. It is honestly hard for me to decide which of these is my favorite now that I have them all (same goes for the creature included).





My thoughts on the Wetlands set:
Even though the bottom of the base's lines are visible on the water part, I'm really impressed with how the water part looks in person, especially when moved around in bright light. The gloss really does a good job at looking like the shimmer on a flowing stream's surface, for example. I also really like that broken cycad sculpted on the base, as well as the addition of horsetails and ferns for some of the accessories included. The translucent effect on the ferns and horsetails is neat too, and better in person for sure, although I have observed that previously with the Araucaria tree included with the Mountains set. The Buitreraptor is a neat addition. Not a species I heard of prior to the kickstarter. It'll be interesting to have the Acheroraptor I ordered on display alongside it, even if they didn't co-exist together.



My thoughts on the Forest pack:
For the base I really like the leaves and cones sculpted on it. Honestly this and the Wetlands set might have my favorite bases out of all the sets thanks to their sculpts. The tree is a nice inclusion, like in the case of the Mountains set, and you can't really have a forest without trees. I think a 'live' Cycad would have been an interesting inclusion too, but at least there's the Cycad log. The fern in the image below is from the Wetlands set. I think it adds to the forest look with it there. The interchangeability between all the little pieces in these sets is definitely a good thing. The Microraptor is probably the highlight of this set for me. I'm so glad to finally have a figure of this little critter at all, let alone one that is accurate to the current evidence. The iridescence on it is subtle but I'm glad it's actually there. This would have been such an interesting looking little creature in life. Also worth a mention is that I ended up snapping the peg off the log when I tried to get it into the Microraptor's foot. That's uh disappointing, since I did want him to 'perch' on the log, but at least there's still work around's with the posing rods and peg holes in the base(s).



I don't think I need to go over the Mountains and Desert packs because I'm pretty sure I have already. I know I've posted pics of them before too, but I took new ones. I'll probably add all these pics to my collection thread because why not.


All that aside, and this is late, but I'm sorry to hear what's happened with you Sim. I don't know or understand all the details, but to have to wait this long, and now nothing. Honestly I'm a bit surprised at this outcome, since David has been helpful and supportive more then enough times for me. At least you were refunded, but I can only imagine how stressing this thing was. If I recall correctly you were also the one to make suggestions for the Microraptor tail and Buitreraptor mouth/teeth so they could be more accurate? Which thankfully did get corrected, since it I think its made for better figures in the end. Again I'm sorry to hear this has happened.

If there's anything I've learned from this whole thing and Saurian that I backed, is that I've learned to be a lot more careful about backing things in the future (which includes doing thorough research about fulfillment history, etc). Either side (backing or not backing) has its risks, especially in the case of action figure production like this, that I've definitely learned. Not backing means cool things probably won't ever see the day of light, but backing could mean jumping the gun way before there's even a product available to 'purchase', and thus waiting for a very long time. There's also the risk of the thing never getting made, or being too different from the prototype, but thankfully that didn't happen in this case (at least not yet). One can only hope that the final reality ends up better then the fantasy that these things can create/cause.

[Faelrin]

So the Styracosaurus color scheme for the ceratopsian line was revealed today on the Creative Beast Studio FB. I really like it, although I'm not sure what it is based on. I can't wait to see this one's prototype get sculpted and painted, even if it takes a while, since Styracosaurus is one of my favorite ceratopsians.

[Minmiminime]

This one would definitely be on the "want" list! I'm a little concerned about the scope of this second project, I do wonder whether it's really worth him doing so many species? It will be great to see some unrepresented species, but...the numbers, and the sheer size of the models and associated costs are dampening my enthusiasm this time around. I'd love a Protoceratops to go with the Velociraptor more than anything

[stegosauria]

So the Styracosaurus color scheme for the ceratopsian line was revealed today on the Creative Beast Studio FB. I really like it, although I'm not sure what it is based on. I can't wait to see this one's prototype get sculpted and painted, even if it takes a while, since Styracosaurus is one of my favorite ceratopsians.

For the inspirítion my bet would go to a male of some desert lizard. Really striking with these turquoise and flame colours. I'm quite curious what will be the Chasmosaurus' and the Diabloceratops' colorus.

[spinosaurus1]

it kinda reminds me of a collared lizard or red headed agama

[Halichoeres]

I think this one might be modeled after Calotes calotes (common green forest lizard) in breeding condition

[Roselaar]

Looking good! Also quite reminiscent of the Carnage Resaurus Styracosaurus, which featured similar colours.

BTW, shouldn't we start a new thread for this second Kickstarter, even though the actual campaign has not yet started?

[Faelrin]

Thanks for that pic Halichoeres. Seems like a good match. I was thinking it would be from a lizard, and the bright colors definitely did make me think of breeding colors.

[IrritatorRaji]

BTW, shouldn't we start a new thread for this second Kickstarter, even though the actual campaign has not yet started?

Part of me is just thinking that we have a general thread for the Beasts Of The Mezozoic line (maybe just change the title of this one or something?)

[Flaffy]

but...the numbers, and the sheer size of the models and associated costs are dampening my enthusiasm this time around.

I feel the same way as well, while a would love to further support this project, the potential size and price of the many figures are a turn off for me. At most I'll be only able to afford 1 offering from the ceratopsian line 

[stegosauria]

but...the numbers, and the sheer size of the models and associated costs are dampening my enthusiasm this time around.

I feel the same way as well, while a would love to further support this project, the potential size and price of the many figures are a turn off for me. At most I'll be only able to afford 1 offering from the ceratopsian line 

My feelings is similar that so many figures (even in 2 waves) is simply an enormous quantity. And these are just the figures and probably they plan some accessory packs too- okay the packs are good I think and probably they won't plan so much of them. And the enthusiasts of the other groups maybe complain a bit when their favourite group will be the focus of the projects if David is planning to continue his work.

I think too we should move the talk about the ceratopsian line into a new thread and the new pictures about the raptor figures could remain of course here.

[stargatedalek]

I'm not particularly interested in the derived ceratopsians but I'm going to be grabbing up all of the earlier members. I'd only seriously consider one of the larger species if it was based on a modern creature I particularly like, so I for one appreciate the sheer number that are being made since that increases the chances of this happening.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

 good way to cut costs would be to sell bodies with various heads that fit them for so many species.  Not sure how that would affect paint though. 

[ImADinosaurRARR]

I myself am excited to get some of the more obscure Ceratopsians. I might also get the Tric (for the inevitable T-rex diorama), Protoceratops (for my raptor pack) and Packy (since it's my favorite ceratopsian).

Also, here is the final sculpt for the Xenoceratops:


Caption by Silva:
After many months of designing, sculpting and intense detailing, I am happy to report that the Beasts of the Mesozoic Xenoceratops action figure sculpt is done! Expect this parts design layout to be the standard for all of the ceratopsian figures moving forward. More pics very soon!

[Jose S.M.]

I'm excited but probably will get only the smallest ceratopsians.

[Shonisaurus]

It is amazing the figures of ceraptosides are very well made in regard to the xenoceratops, I hope they do all the ceraptodoses existing to date and among them the protoceratops. An articulated protoceratops would be very nice. 

[Faelrin]

Protoceratops is one of the 1/6 scale ones planned if this is anything to go by:


I definitely want that one to go with the Velociraptors I ordered (+ the Desert Accessory Pack). Styracosaurus is also one of my must haves of the ceratopsians, and I have a feeling with that color scheme, it'll look good alongside the kestrel Dromaeosaurus, its contemporary, even if they won't be in scale (unless the 1/18th versions of the deluxe raptors get made).


I also do think a separate topic for the ceratopsians line could be handy. Having such a separate topic could possibly generate interest for it that might be overlooked because this current thread's line is based on dromaeosaurids (for the most part). On top of that it would be good to have a first page to have images that could be used for reference or information purposes. Such as the concept art and sculpt in progress pics, and eventually the pics of the painted prototypes.

Until then, for now, here's a link dump of images pertaining to the ceratopsian series (in case anyone needs a refresher or has yet to see these):
Sculpting plan phase 1:
https://scontent.fagc1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/17192317_1675529259128939_8515407714660467652_o.jpg?oh=32ee455747da64685083b10fbbd1d966&oe=5B0B8F76

Sculpting plan phase 2:
https://scontent.fagc1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/17191992_1677000558981809_3503665683495720198_o.jpg?oh=6cc39e97d1adf96725f00e267ba407d5&oe=5B0BB0BC

Xenoceratops colored concept art:
https://scontent.fagc1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/22047729_1924136944268168_2020075658021882971_o.jpg?oh=d4634b35fc7d85e6fee9a33623869a4f&oe=5B0DA8A6

Zuniceratops colored concept art:
https://scontent.fagc1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/21949876_1923132767701919_2954952879322888270_o.jpg?oh=25856f70c1b42fbffa79bc391015bf32&oe=5B0F7DA7

Xenoceratops and Zuniceratops sculpts WIP:
https://scontent.fagc1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22140876_1931637780184751_8719936222235261712_n.jpg?oh=267ddc0366b2fdd30c67a84276f44db1&oe=5B04D9C8