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avatar_Faelrin

So there's a ceratopsian that was described this year called Gremlin

Started by Faelrin, November 26, 2023, 05:26:57 AM

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Faelrin

I'm not even joking. The full name is Gremlin slobodorum. I cannot believe there's literally a dinosaur out there called this, lol. I don't have access to the paper. I only found out about this from browsing wikipedia.

Material is fragmentary as one would expect for something named this. From the above it mentions the specimen is TMP 2011.053.0027, a right frontal bone, so not anything particularly exciting. Additional info consists that it was from the Oldman Formation, Alberta, and the species name honors contributor's Ed and Wendy Sloboda.

I think this is the second prehistoric animal named after a mythological creature this year? I mean there was at least that awesome mosasaur, Jormungandr walhallaensis, from before.
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Jose S.M.

Oh yeah I read some discussion about the name on Twitter (I refuse to call it x still, as my phone is refusing to kill the little bird icon for the app haha). Some people were mad but also read people saying it was fun and fitting for a Leptoceratopsid ( not sure it was that but I think it was or something related at least).

Blade-of-the-Moon

Might have made more sense for a pterosaur..something small and gnarly looking.

andrewsaurus rex

i'm waiting for someone to name a dinosaur Jabberwocky....if I ever found a big scary theropod,  I would.  :)

Stegotyranno420

Victorian Paleontologists are turning in their graves now.

crazy8wizard

There are dozens of prehistoric animals whose genus is just an unaltered mythological creature or character. If Maip, Siats, Balaur, Shri devi, Kurupi, and Citipati are okay why isn't Gremlin?

Concavenator

Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 26, 2023, 05:54:03 PMVictorian Paleontologists are turning in their graves now.

Believe me, the day will come a prehistoric animal is named Shrek.

Stegotyranno420

Quote from: Concavenator on November 27, 2023, 12:11:34 AM
Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 26, 2023, 05:54:03 PMVictorian Paleontologists are turning in their graves now.

Believe me, the day will come a prehistoric animal is named Shrek.
I feel like Paleontologists trying to hard to appeal to the public, since for some reason the layman doesnt care so much for dinosaurs as much anymore. Victorian Paleontologists may have been wrong in their theories, but they made sure Paleontology remained a formal, high cultured subject not contaminated with juvenile refferences to pop-cultural movie, but rather dedicated to the splendor of the primeval beasts.
Quote from: crazy8wizard on November 26, 2023, 10:56:44 PMThere are dozens of prehistoric animals whose genus is just an unaltered mythological creature or character. If Maip, Siats, Balaur, Shri devi, Kurupi, and Citipati are okay why isn't Gremlin?
I don't really like those either. I am fine with Chinese and Sanskrit (citipati is Sanskrit but also is used in a East Asian context if memory serves) names though
Chinese since they started using it so early, theres plenty of genera, and they are usally used in scientific description rather than mere refference.
Sanskrit is also fine, since it is a member of the classical languages trio which also has Latin and Greek(well respected, agreed upon languages) and since all of these ones come from the same source.
Which brings me, most of the most agreed upon languages used to name dinosaurs in Paleontology are from ancient cultures who made major scientific contributions, so it makes sense for Chinese to be used.

Perotorum

Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 27, 2023, 03:02:21 AM
Quote from: Concavenator on November 27, 2023, 12:11:34 AM
Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 26, 2023, 05:54:03 PMVictorian Paleontologists are turning in their graves now.

Believe me, the day will come a prehistoric animal is named Shrek.
I feel like Paleontologists trying to hard to appeal to the public, since for some reason the layman doesnt care so much for dinosaurs as much anymore. Victorian Paleontologists may have been wrong in their theories, but they made sure Paleontology remained a formal, high cultured subject not contaminated with juvenile refferences to pop-cultural movie, but rather dedicated to the splendor of the primeval beasts.
Quote from: crazy8wizard on November 26, 2023, 10:56:44 PMThere are dozens of prehistoric animals whose genus is just an unaltered mythological creature or character. If Maip, Siats, Balaur, Shri devi, Kurupi, and Citipati are okay why isn't Gremlin?
I don't really like those either. I am fine with Chinese and Sanskrit (citipati is Sanskrit but also is used in a East Asian context if memory serves) names though
Chinese since they started using it so early, theres plenty of genera, and they are usally used in scientific description rather than mere refference.
Sanskrit is also fine, since it is a member of the classical languages trio which also has Latin and Greek(well respected, agreed upon languages) and since all of these ones come from the same source.
Which brings me, most of the most agreed upon languages used to name dinosaurs in Paleontology are from ancient cultures who made major scientific contributions, so it makes sense for Chinese to be used.


I mean there was Franz Nopsca, who, to his credit, did not use pop culture references, but the etymology of Kallokibotion bajazidi is arguably infinitely worse than Gremlin Slobodorum as a species name, although, taxa named after mythological creatures such as Anzu Wyeli, Smok Wawelski, and Pendraig are all good examples, a though my favorite example of such, as someone from Alabama would be Cretalamna Bryanti, named after Bear Bryant, a renowned University of Alabama American Football coach, which is the most Alabama name I have heard for any organism. Although, I suppose that a more appropriate mythological creature that preceded gremlins would be a kabbold, which would evolve in American folklore into gremlins, so a less pop-cultured centered name would involve lab olds as opposed to gremlins.

Blade-of-the-Moon




Eatmycar

Gremlin is probably the best description of a baby Triceratops... or a leptoceratopsid. Seriously, if this name was given to Udanoceratops I don't think anyone would bat an eye.

That said, mythological names go hard and if they get people curious about the genera, I'm more than all for it. Sauroposeidon, anyone? It's name literally means lizard of the earthquake god!

Halichoeres

It seems to have been named in a book chapter, which is slightly inconvenient.

Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 26, 2023, 05:54:03 PMVictorian Paleontologists are turning in their graves now.
I like to picture this. Most of them were jerks.

Anyway, I wasn't aware that the only respectable languages are Greek, Latin, Sanskrit, and Chinese.  :-X
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Stegotyranno420

Quote from: Halichoeres on November 28, 2023, 03:25:07 PMIt seems to have been named in a book chapter, which is slightly inconvenient.

Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 26, 2023, 05:54:03 PMVictorian Paleontologists are turning in their graves now.
I like to picture this. Most of them were jerks.

Anyway, I wasn't aware that the only respectable languages are Greek, Latin, Sanskrit, and Chinese.  :-X
Oh my, I forgot: German, Arabic, and Farsi.
but those arent usually paleontological, maybe German.

Takama

Their was one point on the Wikipedia Page where someone used an image of a Grimlin from the Movie of the same name.

It was promptly taken down a day later.

Mellow Stego

Scientists having some fun with scientific names is nothing new. Sonic Hedgehog Anyone?
 I wouldn't want every animal named like this, but a few here and there doesn't hurt. Plus if it helps to get the public interested then that's a win to me.


Quote from: Blade-of-the-Moon on November 27, 2023, 05:37:58 AMJust wait for Pepsiosaurus and Verizodon lol
I wouldn't be surprised. Especially if they start funding digs.
Keep calm and love dinosaurs

Stegotyranno420

I'd much rather have governments fund paleontology than corporations.

Sure its not the end of world if some names arent best.
Some of the classic names are awful, like Struthiosaurus, Titanosuchus, and Basilosaurus, far worse than most modern names.
But don't you ever feel as if every new dinosaur is named after a character franchise. Perhaps the corporations already have began funding. ;)
Thanos, Meraxes, Zuul, Gremlin?

Perotorum

Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 29, 2023, 03:38:57 AMI'd much rather have governments fund paleontology than corporations.

Sure its not the end of world if some names arent best.
Some of the classic names are awful, like Struthiosaurus, Titanosuchus, and Basilosaurus, far worse than most modern names.
But don't you ever feel as if every new dinosaur is named after a character franchise. Perhaps the corporations already have began funding. ;)
Thanos, Meraxes, Zuul, Gremlin?

In addition to an awful name, basilosaurus is also the worst choice for a state fossil for Alabama, it was not originally discovered here, it is not particularly common in the fossil record, it is only tangentially related to the state, and there are many more, satisfying options such as appalachiasaurus, eotracodon, or cretalamna, something who is both endemic to and has a name strongly tied to the state of Alabama, sorry for my rant, but basilosaurus as our state fossil has always been a confusing choice to me, and so I tend to get upset every time it is mentioned.

Faelrin

Meraxes and Zuul kind of work though. Not so much for Thanos. I mean they literally gave it to an abelisaur of all things which have like the smallest arms of any theropod (other then alvarezsaurs I guess).
Film Accurate Mattel JW and JP toys list (incl. extended canon species, etc):
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Every Single Mainline Mattel Jurassic World Species A-Z; 2024 toys added!:
https://dinotoyblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=9974.0

Most produced Paleozoic genera (visual encyclopedia):
https://dinotoyblog.com/forum/index.php?topic=9144.0

CarnotaurusKing

Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 28, 2023, 06:55:19 PM
Quote from: Halichoeres on November 28, 2023, 03:25:07 PMIt seems to have been named in a book chapter, which is slightly inconvenient.

Quote from: Stegotyranno420 on November 26, 2023, 05:54:03 PMVictorian Paleontologists are turning in their graves now.
I like to picture this. Most of them were jerks.

Anyway, I wasn't aware that the only respectable languages are Greek, Latin, Sanskrit, and Chinese.  :-X
Oh my, I forgot: German, Arabic, and Farsi.
but those arent usually paleontological, maybe German.


Pretty strong Indo-European bias. I'm sure it's not your intent, but this sounds a bit yikes. I don't think scientific nomenclature should be restricted to a particular set of languages simply because of "their contributions to science", and neither does the ICZN.

That said, I think Gremlin, Thanos and Zuul are bad names. Well, Zuul is not that bad. My big issue with them is that you need to type in their full binomial name if you want to look them up to avoid confusion with their namesakes (this doesn't affect Zuul so much), which is annoying. That said, Gremlin and Zuul are at least somewhat fitting, it's baffling how a small abelisaurid (that group of dinosaurs famous for basically vestigial arms) is named after an 8 ft tall giant whose main weapon is a gauntlet. Plus the use of such out there names as Gremlin and Thanos for a grand total of 1 bone per taxon.

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